Question:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Looking for a little advice. Ever since I started playing (3 years ago) I’ve used what would seem to be an ultra-strong grip (compared to others I’ve observed). Here’s where it gets weird, the left hand is so strong that the thumb rests way down into the right palm. It felt so unnatural that I started dropping the left thumb down below the right hand (kinda rests against the bootom of the right hand) If your left thumb is "below" the right hand, it sounds like you have gone to a 10 finger, or "baseball" grip. Or do you also still overlap? How many knuckles can you see on your left hand? Where do the V’s point? The most common grip used by the pro’s has 2 knuckles showing on the left hand, the left hand V pointed at the right ear, and the right hand V pointed at the right shoulder. This is a strong grip, but I take it, not as strong as you have. The grip is a very important fundamental, and worth fixing. If you have a bad grip, you don’t WANT a good swing. But the first step is to fix the thing you are compensating for with the bad grip. I suspect it is an over-the-top outside in swing. Learn to swing inside out. You will start hooking like mad, and you’ll adjust your grip on your own. Sorry, I just don’t think you ARE Fred Couples, and I don’t think he uses the grip you describe (with the left thumb "below" the right hand). Immediate scores mean nothing. Only long-term results matter. Or go follow Band-Aide George. Before you buy. mbarry: I hope the stupidity of these comments here is not lost on you. You are NOT bandaiding when you outplay the players of your club. You are swinging with YOUR swing. Did you read Daly? I bet bighorn hasn’t. Unless he is the one who reported here a couple months ago that Daly didn’t know what he was talking about. Bighorn won a couple of majors and drives the ball 340, so ignore daly. George
This is the post I am referring to, George. See how I recommended the SLAP grip, and you called me stupid? I even asked for more details from him, and you called me stupid without knowing the facts yourself. Who, exactly, is being stupid here? Before you buy.
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his. And recommending the SLAP pro grip, on your part, is not recommending the entire SLAP message — that indeed a grip needs to fit each person, not the Pro model as it appears.
Can you tell me where you found this portion of the "SLAP message?" I have read this book over and over, and I have the CD on my computer at work. The overwhelming impression I get from SLAP is "do it this way." Actually you are correct about the message being incomplete. As you read further you will discover that Mann/Griffith say the grip is necessary because of the forward ball position they recommend. Dave Clary/Corpus Christi,TX RSG Clique-Associate Member http://www.geocities.com/~texasp38 RSG Roll Call http://u1.netgate.net/~kirby34/rsg/claryd.htm
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Dave, I can tell you’ve thought about that book by your comment below. Maybe you’re closer to the promised land than you think!
Thanks, Mike..sure hope so. I’ve said it before–I buy into SLAP all the way on an intellectual level. I just wish there was a CompuSport facility here, or at least an instructor who taught it. Tomorrow should be an interesting test. I’m heading back to the course where I played my first few rounds and scored between 118 and 125. It has a lot more water and OB then my home course (but the slope is just a little higher). Dave Clary/Corpus Christi,TX RSG Clique-Associate Member http://www.geocities.com/~texasp38 RSG Roll Call http://u1.netgate.net/~kirby34/rsg/claryd.htm
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his. And recommending the SLAP pro grip, on your part, is not recommending the entire SLAP message — that indeed a grip needs to fit each person, not the Pro model as it appears. Can you tell me where you found this portion of the "SLAP message?" I have read this book over and over, and I have the CD on my computer at work. The overwhelming impression I get from SLAP is "do it this way."
It is subsumed in the overall message about the fact that your grip must naturally return the clubface square and not to use a too strong grip as a bandaid, or to use a too weak grip for its problems. (Hogan’s own grip would probably be to weak for most golfers). But their picture of a too strong grip shows the RIGHT hand turned under the club, and that is the wrong part. The position [amount of rotation of the left hand and how to express its degree of rotation ]of the LEFT HAND on the shaft is reality is not a precise measurement and it will depend on the size of the grip, the size of the golfer’s hand, and the inward hang of his own hands when at rest (very toed in or less toed in). Els uses a weaker grip than the model; Couples a stronger –BUT BOTH AS TO LEFT HAND ONLY. There is no direct quote in Mann that allows for exceptions. But I think I am fair in filling in the blanks as to how Mann would address Ernie, or Freddie, or any other golfer whose swing pattern did NOT need compensating. You also picked up on the overall message, no? Actually you are correct about the message being incomplete. As you read further you will discover that Mann/Griffith say the grip is necessary because of the forward ball position they recommend.
It is not forward ball position. It is that IMPACT occurs with the hands so much ahead of the clubhead, that the clubface is not yet closed. Ball position that Mann recommends is under the left ear, appx. Which is a hair forward of what I think is better for most players because impact before low point is a bit easier than at that critical point. But each golfer needs to work out for himself what works the best within reason. Dave Clary/Corpus Christi,TX – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – RSG Clique-Associate Member http://www.geocities.com/~texasp38 RSG Roll Call http://u1.netgate.net/~kirby34/rsg/claryd.htm
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Dave, I can tell you’ve thought about that book by your comment below. Maybe you’re closer to the promised land than you think! It certainly suggests reading the whole book before drawing any firm conclusions. Mike – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – his. And recommending the SLAP pro grip, on your part, is not recommending the entire SLAP message — that indeed a grip needs to fit each person, not the Pro model as it appears. Can you tell me where you found this portion of the "SLAP message?" I have read this book over and over, and I have the CD on my computer at work. The overwhelming impression I get from SLAP is "do it this way." Actually you are correct about the message being incomplete. As you read further you will discover that Mann/Griffith say the grip is necessary because of the forward ball position they recommend. Dave Clary/Corpus Christi,TX RSG Clique-Associate Member http://www.geocities.com/~texasp38 RSG Roll Call http://u1.netgate.net/~kirby34/rsg/claryd.htm
– Mike Dalecki–Charter Member, RSG Clique I do not patronize spammers! Help keep RSG clean. Expect the same etiquette from me on RSG as on the golf course. RSG Roll Call: http://u1.netgate.net/~kirby34/rsg/daleckim.htm
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<snip Does Daly really use a 10 finger grip? I didn’t remember that being the case. How many other pros do? Do you think there is a reason that the majority of pros swing a particular way, and grip the club a particular way?
That’s weird. This just came up in another thread. Bernhard Langer won his first Masters with a ten-finger grip. But, his thumb wasn’t screwed around the shaft behind the rigth hand! — Barry http://www.golfopia.com
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Looking for a little advice. Ever since I started playing (3 years ago) I’ve used what would seem to be an ultra-strong grip (compared to others I’ve observed). Here’s where it gets weird, the left hand is so strong that the thumb rests way down into the right palm. It felt so unnatural that I started dropping the left thumb down below the right hand (kinda rests against the bootom of the right hand) If your left thumb is "below" the right hand, it sounds like you have gone to a 10 finger, or "baseball" grip. Or do you also still overlap? How many knuckles can you see on your left hand? Where do the V’s point? The most common grip used by the pro’s has 2 knuckles showing on the left hand, the left hand V pointed at the right ear, and the right hand V pointed at the right shoulder. This is a strong grip, but I take it, not as strong as you have. The grip is a very important fundamental, and worth fixing. If you have a bad grip, you don’t WANT a good swing. But the first step is to fix the thing you are compensating for with the bad grip. I suspect it is an over-the-top outside in swing. Learn to swing inside out. You will start hooking like mad, and you’ll adjust your grip on your own. Sorry, I just don’t think you ARE Fred Couples, and I don’t think he uses the grip you describe (with the left thumb "below" the right hand). Immediate scores mean nothing. Only long-term results matter. Or go follow Band-Aide George. Before you buy. mbarry: I hope the stupidity of these comments here is not lost on you. You are NOT bandaiding when you outplay the players of your club. You are swinging with YOUR swing. Did you read Daly? I bet bighorn hasn’t. Unless he is the one who reported here a couple months ago that Daly didn’t know what he was talking about. Bighorn won a couple of majors and drives the ball 340, so ignore daly. George This is the post I am referring to, George. See how I recommended the SLAP grip, and you called me stupid? I even asked for more details from him, and you called me stupid without knowing the facts yourself. Who, exactly, is being stupid here?
This single post does not establish the whole context for the stupidity comment. First, there was a presumption that mbarry had a too strong grip. His reported ball striking of such success and distance was not, IMO, due to or under influce of a compensated grip. Daly and Couples DO have a very strong grip and I do not subscribe to any theory that either one is "compensating". And if Mann says that NO one is to use a stronger grip than his Pro model, we would not ever have heard of Keuhne, Daly, Azinger, Duval, Langer, Couples, and a host of other very well know household names. I do not believe Mann intends to blanket that anything stronger than his picture of the Pro model is "incorrect" or compensating in nature. Further, even if it might be, I would argue and he would also probably agree that the "compensation" word is unfair, that in actuality it is a PERSONAL ADJUSTMENT concern based on a given physical shape/strength/balance of forces within the individual golfer that is of more importance and that gives rise to the grip he finds works the best. Mann’s BASIC is the PRINCIPLE, i.e., that the grip TAKEN must AUTOMATICALLY return the clubface square for separation, other things being correct as to timing and path. If that works for the golfer, we do not have the right to assume he is compensating and is therefor employing inferior technique. I believe I myself addressed mbarry with the point that the left thumb belonged down the shaft, as well as inside the pocket of the right palm, as far as that part was concerned. I felt he might be saying that his left thumb CROSSED the shaft and extended DOWN UNDER it below the right hand lifeline pocket. But you had condemned him before knowing any more than this brief post of his. And recommending the SLAP pro grip, on your part, is not recommending the entire SLAP message — that indeed a grip needs to fit each person, not the Pro model as it appears. My take on mbarry’s success with his chosen protocol (except the left thumb off the shaft) was that he was already right on the money. He had not indicated that he is fighting a hook….(The left thumb BELONGS "way down into the right palm", per Pro, SLAP. Page 46, 2nd paragraph: "Now close your right hand, folding the lifeline of your right palm snugly around your left thumb.")
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Ever since I started playing (3 years ago) I’ve used what would seem to be an ultra-strong grip (compared to others I’ve observed). Here’s where it gets weird, the left hand is so strong that the thumb rests way down into the right palm. Bad habits are hard to break, and a bad grip is a very bad habit. If you don’t fix it now, when you are a relative newby, it will be 10x harder to change in 10 years. But LIKE I SAID, fix the root cause for the compensating grip FIRST. Then you will be forced to fix the grip.
I havn’t been following this thread, so, with a grain of salt, let me add: I agree with what Big say’s above. I too have used a compensating grip, and it worked to my advantage…I rotated ny right hand into a strong position to accelerate my wrist break and close the clubface (slice fighting). It helped a lot…But with practice, offset clubs, and low sidespin balls, I gradually tamed the slice tendencys to the point that the grip was causing hooks…In my case, reorienting to a standard grip was easy. ]]]Z[[[
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- Hide quoted text -- Show quoted text - Looking for a little advice. Ever since I started playing (3 years ago) I've used what would seem to be an ultra-strong grip (compared to others I've observed). Here's where it gets weird, the left hand is so strong that the thumb rests way down into the right palm. It felt so unnatural that I started dropping the left thumb down below the right hand (kinda rests against the bootom of the right hand) If your left thumb is "below" the right hand, it sounds like you have gone to a 10 finger, or "baseball" grip. Or do you also still overlap? How many knuckles can you see on your left hand? Where do the V's point? The most common grip used by the pro's has 2 knuckles showing on the left hand, the left hand V pointed at the right ear, and the right hand V pointed at the right shoulder. This is a strong grip, but I take it, not as strong as you have. The grip is a very important fundamental, and worth fixing. If you have a bad grip, you don't WANT a good swing. But the first step is to fix the thing you are compensating for with the bad grip. I suspect it is an over-the-top outside in swing. Learn to swing inside out. You will start hooking like mad, and you'll adjust your grip on your own. Sorry, I just don't think you ARE Fred Couples, and I don't think he uses the grip you describe (with the left thumb "below" the right hand). Immediate scores mean nothing. Only long-term results matter. Or go follow Band-Aide George. Before you buy. mbarry: I hope the stupidity of these comments here is not lost on you. You are NOT bandaiding when you outplay the players of your club. You are swinging with YOUR swing. Did you read Daly? I bet bighorn hasn't. Unless he is the one who reported here a couple months ago that Daly didn't know what he was talking about. Bighorn won a couple of majors and drives the ball 340, so ignore daly. George
So George, you think the grip he describes is a good one, with the left thumb rotated so far that it is no longer under the right hand? Who is stupid? You have admitted to not reading SLAP. I DID read Daly's book some years ago. Do you think we should model our swings on Daly? You can't seem to make up your mind who we should copy. Is it Daly, Ernie, Jack, Chi Chi, Tiger, Hogan... according to you, they are ALL Gravity Golfers. Does Daly really use a 10 finger grip? I didn't remember that being the case. How many other pros do? Do you think there is a reason that the majority of pros swing a particular way, and grip the club a particular way? Should you fix your slice just by strengthening your grip and bending your clubs upright, or should you try to fix the root cause? Which is more stupid? Bad habits are hard to break, and a bad grip is a very bad habit. If you don't fix it now, when you are a relative newby, it will be 10x harder to change in 10 years. But LIKE I SAID, fix the root cause for the compensating grip FIRST. Then you will be forced to fix the grip. Before you buy.
Response:
- Hide quoted text -- Show quoted text - Looking for a little advice. Ever since I started playing (3 years ago) I've used what would seem to be an ultra-strong grip (compared to others I've observed). Here's where it gets weird, the left hand is so strong that the thumb rests way down into the right palm. It felt so unnatural that I started dropping the left thumb down below the right hand (kinda rests against the bootom of the right hand) If your left thumb is "below" the right hand, it sounds like you have gone to a 10 finger, or "baseball" grip. Or do you also still overlap? How many knuckles can you see on your left hand? Where do the V's point? The most common grip used by the pro's has 2 knuckles showing on the left hand, the left hand V pointed at the right ear, and the right hand V pointed at the right shoulder. This is a strong grip, but I take it, not as strong as you have. The grip is a very important fundamental, and worth fixing. If you have a bad grip, you don't WANT a good swing. But the first step is to fix the thing you are compensating for with the bad grip. I suspect it is an over-the-top outside in swing. Learn to swing inside out. You will start hooking like mad, and you'll adjust your grip on your own. Sorry, I just don't think you ARE Fred Couples, and I don't think he uses the grip you describe (with the left thumb "below" the right hand). Immediate scores mean nothing. Only long-term results matter. Or go follow Band-Aide George. Before you buy. mbarry: I hope the stupidity of these comments here is not lost on you. You are NOT bandaiding when you outplay the players of your club. You are swinging with YOUR swing. Did you read Daly? I bet bighorn hasn't. Unless he is the one who reported here a couple months ago that Daly didn't know what he was talking about. Bighorn won a couple of majors and drives the ball 340, so ignore daly. George So George, you think the grip he describes is a good one, with the left thumb rotated so far that it is no longer under the right hand?
Nope. I told him exactly the opposite: to keep the left thumb on the shaft inside the right palm fold. Who is stupid? You have admitted to not reading SLAP. I DID read Daly's book some years ago. Do you think we should model our swings on Daly?
Nope as to things John does that are well beyond the average man's range of motion and strength. I told him that John's discussion of his strong grip was worth reading for its comments on why he uses it. It is John's story, with which I agree and with which other strong-grip swingers games agree. You can't seem to make up your mind who we should copy. Is it Daly, Ernie, Jack, Chi Chi, Tiger, Hogan... according to you, they are ALL Gravity Golfers.
YUP, and YOUR lack of understanding of Gravity Golf is precisely why this is lost on you. Gravity golf is not an appearance of a certain shape. It is an explanation of great physical efficiency accomplished by subconscious mechanisms where wrong exertions have been eliminated. It can take many different physical APPEARANCES, the same as walking appears different in all people. Gotcha again, bh. A facile reading of ANYTHING -- Daly, Gravity Golf, or you name it, will ALWAYS come up short. For a post TODAY that addresses this reality about subconscious mechanisms, read jim 11/29 3:15 am, Re Swinging like an Ax Person. Does Daly really use a 10 finger grip? I didn't remember that being the case. How many other pros do? Do you think there is a reason that the majority of pros swing a particular way, and grip the club a particular way?
Yes; because they have found what fits their hands. I never addressed the 10 finger grip. Should you fix your slice just by strengthening your grip and bending your clubs upright, or should you try to fix the root cause? Which is more stupid?
So, Dr. Bill: John Daly, Fred Couples, Paul Azinger, Bernhard Langer, David Duval, Hank Kuehne, and scores of others are fixing their slices with bandaids. And apparently they are stupid for gripping the way they do. Please go to their next tour stop and offer your services to fix their slices. Tell them the root cause. Incidentally, you didn't tell me what IS the root cause of their slices. And we are waiting for you to post the scores for your majors. And minors. We are not talking a golfer or two, bh. But what do scores [two meanings: many, and their golf scores] of the world’s top golfers know/prove about anything? I find your comments totally incomprehensible, bh. Just beyond words. Bad habits are hard to break, and a bad grip is a very bad habit. If you don’t fix it now, when you are a relative newby, it will be 10x harder to change in 10 years. But LIKE I SAID, fix the root cause for the compensating grip FIRST. Then you will be forced to fix the grip.
It is precisely this kind of poison that Daly is talking about on page 7 (you said you read his book? It would appear you need remedial reading! Or maybe you didn’t believe him. Which posture do you prefer: inability to read, or a posture that Daly and company are wrong? I promise you, bh. you can’t win from either one! There is no third option. Again: either Daly is wrong, or you did not grasp what he wrote.) Intelligence, the way I describe it, is intellectual honesty. If this is difficult for you, they have logic courses that you can probably get very inexpensively at your local community college (seriously). And remedial reading is CERTAINly available from the same source, probably for free. For the benefit of those who missed the former post on this, I’ll quote him: "I see many ATHLETIC [my emphasis] amateurs struggle to play golf with a weak grip, mostly because they think it is something they HAVE to do to be good. Owing to this misconception, the typical "weak gripper" starts toying with his swing when his shots fly off line, instead of changing the way he holds the club. Before you know it, he does ten different things wrong. I’ve seen this happen a thousand times [as I have --GH speaking]. There are gas stations all over the country staffed by young men who insisted they could play with a weak grip. … I might add that there is a long list of great players who have come to the same conclusion I have." The entire quote and attention to this whole issue runs FOR 4+ PAGES from page 4 through page 9. Not lip service. Not "maybe". Nope, serious words. Again; tell us why his comments are bandaids. What is the root cause of John’s slice? Thank you. George
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Looking for a little advice. Ever since I started playing (3 years ago) I’ve used what would seem to be an ultra-strong grip (compared to others I’ve observed). Here’s where it gets weird, the left hand is so strong that the thumb rests way down into the right palm. It felt so unnatural that I started dropping the left thumb down below the right hand (kinda rests against the bootom of the right hand)
If your left thumb is "below" the right hand, it sounds like you have gone to a 10 finger, or "baseball" grip. Or do you also still overlap? How many knuckles can you see on your left hand? Where do the V’s point? The most common grip used by the pro’s has 2 knuckles showing on the left hand, the left hand V pointed at the right ear, and the right hand V pointed at the right shoulder. This is a strong grip, but I take it, not as strong as you have. The grip is a very important fundamental, and worth fixing. If you have a bad grip, you don’t WANT a good swing. But the first step is to fix the thing you are compensating for with the bad grip. I suspect it is an over-the-top outside in swing. Learn to swing inside out. You will start hooking like mad, and you’ll adjust your grip on your own. Sorry, I just don’t think you ARE Fred Couples, and I don’t think he uses the grip you describe (with the left thumb "below" the right hand). Immediate scores mean nothing. Only long-term results matter. Or go follow Band-Aide George. Before you buy.
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Looking for a little advice. Ever since I started playing (3 years ago) I’ve used what would seem to be an ultra-strong grip (compared to others I’ve observed). Here’s where it gets weird, the left hand is so strong that the thumb rests way down into the right palm. It felt so unnatural that I started dropping the left thumb down below the right hand (kinda rests against the bootom of the right hand) If your left thumb is "below" the right hand, it sounds like you have gone to a 10 finger, or "baseball" grip. Or do you also still overlap? How many knuckles can you see on your left hand? Where do the V’s point? The most common grip used by the pro’s has 2 knuckles showing on the left hand, the left hand V pointed at the right ear, and the right hand V pointed at the right shoulder. This is a strong grip, but I take it, not as strong as you have. The grip is a very important fundamental, and worth fixing. If you have a bad grip, you don’t WANT a good swing. But the first step is to fix the thing you are compensating for with the bad grip. I suspect it is an over-the-top outside in swing. Learn to swing inside out. You will start hooking like mad, and you’ll adjust your grip on your own. Sorry, I just don’t think you ARE Fred Couples, and I don’t think he uses the grip you describe (with the left thumb "below" the right hand). Immediate scores mean nothing. Only long-term results matter. Or go follow Band-Aide George. Before you buy.
mbarry: I hope the stupidity of these comments here is not lost on you. You are NOT bandaiding when you outplay the players of your club. You are swinging with YOUR swing. Did you read Daly? I bet bighorn hasn’t. Unless he is the one who reported here a couple months ago that Daly didn’t know what he was talking about. Bighorn won a couple of majors and drives the ball 340, so ignore daly. George
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Question: 1.Has anyone ever seen or used this type of grip?? 2.Do you think it is worth the inevitable slump to change ???(with the possibility of never getting back to where I am right now)
If it works for you stick with it…there is no such thing as a universally ‘correct’ grip. It sounds as though it may be causing you some difficulty around the green though….but stay with it, you just need more practice in that area! You may discover over time that a minor alteration will suit you better but don’t start fiddling……a better grip usually comes by accident, just wait for it to happen. In my view, for a hacker, tee to green performance is far more important in scoring than the short game. It is usually only single figure handicappers who gain anything by working to improve this. Don’t jeopardise your tee-to-green performance just for the sake of change to a supposedly ‘correct’ grip. david
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thanks George, I didnt really want to change, was really looking for feedback if a change MIGHT help. Didnt realize that some pro’s use a similar grip, I’ve never seen at the local muni. Maybe I just needed a little reassurance, a few so called "experts" that I’ve been paired up with have offered to "straighten me out" while I was in the middle of shooting an 80 or 81(no mulligans,putting out) to their 100+ if you counted all their strokes BTW, went out today on a slope 111 course and hit 10 fairways and 11 greens for a 79 which included 4 3putts, so its obvious where I need to improve. My chipping is also problematic, do you think there would be any merit in trying a weaker or maybe even a baseball grip for these finesse shots?? The strong grip does feel slightly awkward for anything other than a bump and run.
mbarry: : I think you need to experiment with hybrids between putting and full shot grips in your left hand especially to see what is most comfy and can produce the least manipulation of wrists and hands to deliver the club to the ball EXACTLY square to the target line. I fidget all the time, because my lie angle is not upright enough with my regular clubs for the best possible chip. I am considering bending a wedge to some 80 degrees or more to get the lie angle that will work the best for me. It probably will mean I’ll use as strong a grip as you do. INCIDENTALLY AND VERY IMPORTANT: the further back in your stance (as at your right toe for chipping) the ball, THE STRONGER your left hand needs to be simply due to the angle at which your left arm will fall from your shoulder when you hang it back there. So you use your natural arm orientation, not a contrived or artificial or book one. George Thanx for the feedback. P.S. Your technical post are always welcome as far as I’m concerned, George. They are alway concise and aptly worded, I just don’t see why some here have a problem.
Thank you. I appreciate that. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – In addition to my former post, this is such a serious subject my brame would not let it go: 1) Start of page 6 of John Daly’s book, not page 9. 2) If you are guilted by the perception that because you use a strong grip you must be an inferior golfer, you have it BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACKWARDS. Your success is proof of what fits YOU, not someone’s handbook, or any other schlepping "top pro" or anyone else that PRETENDS to teach golf in books, magazines, TV or the range. YOUR GRIP is YOUR grip, the same as your girth is YOURs, the same as Trevino’s open stance is HIS, the same as Nicklaus flying elbow is HIS. Imagine Freddie trying to change his grip. Give me a loooooooooooooooooooooong break. PLEASE go to confession over this guilt trip. It is an insidious and extremely damaging "basic" – the weak grip. It is ok for SOME golfers. So is a size 42 extra long suit. Accept the success of your strong grip as evidence of what is right for you, if nothing else. Not my words, not anyone else; just the success of your shots. And do inspect those mentioned, as well as Hank Keuhne. Many others too. George Looking for a little advice. Ever since I started playing (3 years ago) I’ve used what would seem to be an ultra-strong grip (compared to others I’ve observed). Here’s where it gets weird, the left hand is so strong that the thumb rests way down into the right palm. It felt so unnatural that I started dropping the left thumb down below the right hand (kinda rests against the bootom of the right hand) THAT’S TOO FAR DOWN. YOU HAD IT RIGHT WITH IT ALIGNED IN THE LIFELINE POCKET OF THE RIGHT HAND. Welcome to the Couples, Daly, Azinger, Duval, Langer club. GREAT DISCOVERY. Don’t ever let anyone talk you out of it! George Little more info. before everyone flames me here, I am down to a 12 hdcp and am better from tee to green than I am around the green. I can probably drop another 2 to 4 strokes around the green next year just from dedicating more time to the short game (which I plan to do) As far as ball-striking, I am routinely the longest and straightest in my circle of hacker friends and can keep up with the "players" at my local club on most days(usually getting beat around the green). Question: 1.Has anyone ever seen or used this type of grip?? AS ABOVE. LOOK AT PICS OF THESE GUYS CLOSE UP. 2.Do you think it is worth the inevitable slump to change ???(with the possibility of never getting back to where I am right now) DON’T YOU DARE CHANGE. READ PAGE 9 OF JOHN DALY’S BOOK. George
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<snip NOT A CHANCE; THAT IS A DIFFERENT AREA OF GOLF TECHNIQUE, AND IT HAS ITS OWN PROBLEMS. GRIP IS NOT LIKELY TO BE ONE OF THEM, TO SAY NOTHING OF USING A DIFFERENT ONE THAN FOR SUCCESSFUL FULL SHOTS.
<snip ANYONE WHO OUTHITS THE PLAYERS AT HIS CLUB IS NOT A HACKER. A PUTTER MAYBE HE ISN’T, BUT HACKER? YOU KIDDING? THIS MAN IS A PLAYER IN HIS DEVELOPMENTAL INFANCY. EXPECT TO PLAY SUB PAR VERY SOON, MBARRY!
<snip RIGHT ON, DAVID. SUPPOSEDLY IS THE OPERATIVE WORD. IT IS THE LIE OF MAINSTREAM GOLF INSTRUCTION [weak grip] THAT CAUSES HIM THE GUILT HE EXPRESSES. HIS GRIP IS PROBABLY SUPREMELY CORRECT! And it has NOTHING to do with his around the green performance either. Period.
<snip George….please do not shout….you are loud enough already! 
david
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Question: 1.Has anyone ever seen or used this type of grip?? 2.Do you think it is worth the inevitable slump to change ???(with the possibility of never getting back to where I am right now) If it works for you stick with it…there is no such thing as a universally ‘correct’ grip. It sounds as though it may be causing you some difficulty around the green though….
NOT A CHANCE; THAT IS A DIFFERENT AREA OF GOLF TECHNIQUE, AND IT HAS ITS OWN PROBLEMS. GRIP IS NOT LIKELY TO BE ONE OF THEM, TO SAY NOTHING OF USING A DIFFERENT ONE THAN FOR SUCCESSFUL FULL SHOTS. but stay with it, you just need more practice in that area! You may discover over time that a minor alteration will suit you better but don’t start fiddling……a better grip usually comes by accident, just wait for it to happen. In my view, for a hacker, tee to green performance is far more important in scoring than the short game.
ANYONE WHO OUTHITS THE PLAYERS AT HIS CLUB IS NOT A HACKER. A PUTTER MAYBE HE ISN’T, BUT HACKER? YOU KIDDING? THIS MAN IS A PLAYER IN HIS DEVELOPMENTAL INFANCY. EXPECT TO PLAY SUB PAR VERY SOON, MBARRY! George It is usually only single figure handicappers who gain anything by working to improve this. Don’t jeopardise your tee-to-green performance just for the sake of change to a supposedly ‘correct’ grip. david
RIGHT ON, DAVID. SUPPOSEDLY IS THE OPERATIVE WORD. IT IS THE LIE OF MAINSTREAM GOLF INSTRUCTION [weak grip] THAT CAUSES HIM THE GUILT HE EXPRESSES. HIS GRIP IS PROBABLY SUPREMELY CORRECT! And it has NOTHING to do with his around the green performance either. Period. George – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –
Response:
My chipping is also problematic, do you think there would be any merit in trying a weaker or maybe even a baseball grip for these finesse shots?? The strong grip does feel slightly awkward for anything other than a bump and run.
Don’t know if you’ve read Pelz or not but this is a key part of his prescription for the short game. There have been a few other contributors here who have said they’ve tried it with success. Dave Clary/Corpus Christi,TX RSG Clique-Associate Member http://www.geocities.com/~texasp38 RSG Roll Call http://u1.netgate.net/~kirby34/rsg/claryd.htm
Response:
Thanks George, I didnt really want to change, was really looking for feedback if a change MIGHT help. Didnt realize that some pro’s use a similar grip, I’ve never seen at the local muni. Maybe I just needed a little reassurance, a few so called "experts" that I’ve been paired up with have offered to "straighten me out" while I was in the middle of shooting an 80 or 81(no mulligans,putting out) to their 100+ if you counted all their strokes BTW, went out today on a slope 111 course and hit 10 fairways and 11 greens for a 79 which included 4 3putts, so its obvious where I need to improve. My chipping is also problematic, do you think there would be any merit in trying a weaker or maybe even a baseball grip for these finesse shots?? The strong grip does feel slightly awkward for anything other than a bump and run. Thanx for the feedback. P.S. Your technical post are always welcome as far as I’m concerned, George. They are alway concise and aptly worded, I just don’t see why some here have a problem. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – In addition to my former post, this is such a serious subject my brame would not let it go: 1) Start of page 6 of John Daly’s book, not page 9. 2) If you are guilted by the perception that because you use a strong grip you must be an inferior golfer, you have it BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACKWARDS. Your success is proof of what fits YOU, not someone’s handbook, or any other schlepping "top pro" or anyone else that PRETENDS to teach golf in books, magazines, TV or the range. YOUR GRIP is YOUR grip, the same as your girth is YOURs, the same as Trevino’s open stance is HIS, the same as Nicklaus flying elbow is HIS. Imagine Freddie trying to change his grip. Give me a loooooooooooooooooooooong break. PLEASE go to confession over this guilt trip. It is an insidious and extremely damaging "basic" – the weak grip. It is ok for SOME golfers. So is a size 42 extra long suit. Accept the success of your strong grip as evidence of what is right for you, if nothing else. Not my words, not anyone else; just the success of your shots. And do inspect those mentioned, as well as Hank Keuhne. Many others too. George Looking for a little advice. Ever since I started playing (3 years ago) I’ve used what would seem to be an ultra-strong grip (compared to others I’ve observed). Here’s where it gets weird, the left hand is so strong that the thumb rests way down into the right palm. It felt so unnatural that I started dropping the left thumb down below the right hand (kinda rests against the bootom of the right hand) THAT’S TOO FAR DOWN. YOU HAD IT RIGHT WITH IT ALIGNED IN THE LIFELINE POCKET OF THE RIGHT HAND. Welcome to the Couples, Daly, Azinger, Duval, Langer club. GREAT DISCOVERY. Don’t ever let anyone talk you out of it! George Little more info. before everyone flames me here, I am down to a 12 hdcp and am better from tee to green than I am around the green. I can probably drop another 2 to 4 strokes around the green next year just from dedicating more time to the short game (which I plan to do) As far as ball-striking, I am routinely the longest and straightest in my circle of hacker friends and can keep up with the "players" at my local club on most days(usually getting beat around the green). Question: 1.Has anyone ever seen or used this type of grip?? AS ABOVE. LOOK AT PICS OF THESE GUYS CLOSE UP. 2.Do you think it is worth the inevitable slump to change ???(with the possibility of never getting back to where I am right now) DON’T YOU DARE CHANGE. READ PAGE 9 OF JOHN DALY’S BOOK. George
Response:
Yes, learn to chip with a neutral grip. Chipping is helped by taking the hands out of the shot.
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Thanks George, I didnt really want to change, was really looking for feedback if a change MIGHT help. Didnt realize that some pro’s use a similar grip, I’ve never seen at the local muni. Maybe I just needed a little reassurance, a few so called "experts" that I’ve been paired up with have offered to "straighten me out" while I was in the middle of shooting an 80 or 81(no mulligans,putting out) to their 100+ if you counted all their strokes BTW, went out today on a slope 111 course and hit 10 fairways and 11 greens for a 79 which included 4 3putts, so its obvious where I need to improve. My chipping is also problematic, do you think there would be any merit in trying a weaker or maybe even a baseball grip for these finesse shots?? The strong grip does feel slightly awkward for anything other than a bump and run. Thanx for the feedback. P.S. Your technical post are always welcome as far as I’m concerned, George. They are alway concise and aptly worded, I just don’t see why some here have a problem. In addition to my former post, this is such a serious subject my brame would not let it go: 1) Start of page 6 of John Daly’s book, not page 9. 2) If you are guilted by the perception that because you use a strong grip you must be an inferior golfer, you have it BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACKWARDS. Your success is proof of what fits YOU, not someone’s handbook, or any other schlepping "top pro" or anyone else that PRETENDS to teach golf in books, magazines, TV or the range. YOUR GRIP is YOUR grip, the same as your girth is YOURs, the same as Trevino’s open stance is HIS, the same as Nicklaus flying elbow is HIS. Imagine Freddie trying to change his grip. Give me a loooooooooooooooooooooong break. PLEASE go to confession over this guilt trip. It is an insidious and extremely damaging "basic" – the weak grip. It is ok for SOME golfers. So is a size 42 extra long suit. Accept the success of your strong grip as evidence of what is right for you, if nothing else. Not my words, not anyone else; just the success of your shots. And do inspect those mentioned, as well as Hank Keuhne. Many others too. George Looking for a little advice. Ever since I started playing (3 years ago) I’ve used what would seem to be an ultra-strong grip (compared to others I’ve observed). Here’s where it gets weird, the left hand is so strong that the thumb rests way down into the right palm. It felt so unnatural that I started dropping the left thumb down below the right hand (kinda rests against the bootom of the right hand) THAT’S TOO FAR DOWN. YOU HAD IT RIGHT WITH IT ALIGNED IN THE LIFELINE POCKET OF THE RIGHT HAND. Welcome to the Couples, Daly, Azinger, Duval, Langer club. GREAT DISCOVERY. Don’t ever let anyone talk you out of it! George Little more info. before everyone flames me here, I am down to a 12 hdcp and am better from tee to green than I am around the green. I can probably drop another 2 to 4 strokes around the green next year just from dedicating more time to the short game (which I plan to do) As far as ball-striking, I am routinely the longest and straightest in my circle of hacker friends and can keep up with the "players" at my local club on most days(usually getting beat around the green). Question: 1.Has anyone ever seen or used this type of grip?? AS ABOVE. LOOK AT PICS OF THESE GUYS CLOSE UP. 2.Do you think it is worth the inevitable slump to change ???(with the possibility of never getting back to where I am right now) DON’T YOU DARE CHANGE. READ PAGE 9 OF JOHN DALY’S BOOK. George
Response:
In addition to my former post, this is such a serious subject my brame would not let it go: 1) Start of page 6 of John Daly’s book, not page 9. 2) If you are guilted by the perception that because you use a strong grip you must be an inferior golfer, you have it BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACKWARDS. Your success is proof of what fits YOU, not someone’s handbook, or any other schlepping "top pro" or anyone else that PRETENDS to teach golf in books, magazines, TV or the range. YOUR GRIP is YOUR grip, the same as your girth is YOURs, the same as Trevino’s open stance is HIS, the same as Nicklaus flying elbow is HIS. Imagine Freddie trying to change his grip. Give me a loooooooooooooooooooooong break. PLEASE go to confession over this guilt trip. It is an insidious and extremely damaging "basic" – the weak grip. It is ok for SOME golfers. So is a size 42 extra long suit. Accept the success of your strong grip as evidence of what is right for you, if nothing else. Not my words, not anyone else; just the success of your shots. And do inspect those mentioned, as well as Hank Keuhne. Many others too. George – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Looking for a little advice. Ever since I started playing (3 years ago) I’ve used what would seem to be an ultra-strong grip (compared to others I’ve observed). Here’s where it gets weird, the left hand is so strong that the thumb rests way down into the right palm. It felt so unnatural that I started dropping the left thumb down below the right hand (kinda rests against the bootom of the right hand) THAT’S TOO FAR DOWN. YOU HAD IT RIGHT WITH IT ALIGNED IN THE LIFELINE POCKET OF THE RIGHT HAND. Welcome to the Couples, Daly, Azinger, Duval, Langer club. GREAT DISCOVERY. Don’t ever let anyone talk you out of it! George Little more info. before everyone flames me here, I am down to a 12 hdcp and am better from tee to green than I am around the green. I can probably drop another 2 to 4 strokes around the green next year just from dedicating more time to the short game (which I plan to do) As far as ball-striking, I am routinely the longest and straightest in my circle of hacker friends and can keep up with the "players" at my local club on most days(usually getting beat around the green). Question: 1.Has anyone ever seen or used this type of grip?? AS ABOVE. LOOK AT PICS OF THESE GUYS CLOSE UP. 2.Do you think it is worth the inevitable slump to change ???(with the possibility of never getting back to where I am right now) DON’T YOU DARE CHANGE. READ PAGE 9 OF JOHN DALY’S BOOK. George
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Are you saying your grip is stronger than Couples? Where is your left thumb … below the right hand? And you use it around the greens, too? I’ve got to see this … do you have a picture by chance? Looking for a little advice. Ever since I started playing (3 years ago) I’ve used what would seem to be an ultra-strong grip (compared to others I’ve observed). Here’s where it gets weird, the left hand is so strong that the thumb rests way down into the right palm. It felt so unnatural that I started dropping the left thumb down below the right hand (kinda rests against the bootom of the right hand)
THAT’S TOO FAR DOWN. YOU HAD IT RIGHT WITH IT ALIGNED IN THE LIFELINE POCKET OF THE RIGHT HAND. Welcome to the Couples, Daly, Azinger, Duval, Langer club. GREAT DISCOVERY. Don’t ever let anyone talk you out of it! George Little more info. before everyone flames me here, I am down to a 12 hdcp and am better from tee to green than I am around the green. I can probably drop another 2 to 4 strokes around the green next year just from dedicating more time to the short game (which I plan to do) As far as ball-striking, I am routinely the longest and straightest in my circle of hacker friends and can keep up with the "players" at my local club on most days(usually getting beat around the green). Question: 1.Has anyone ever seen or used this type of grip?? AS
ABOVE. LOOK AT PICS OF THESE GUYS CLOSE UP. 2.Do you think it is worth the inevitable slump to change ???(with the possibility of never getting back to where I am right now) DON’T YOU DARE CHANGE. READ PAGE 9 OF JOHN DALY’S BOOK.
George
Response:
Are you saying your grip is stronger than Couples? Where is your left thumb … below the right hand? And you use it around the greens, too? I’ve got to see this … do you have a picture by chance? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Looking for a little advice. Ever since I started playing (3 years ago) I’ve used what would seem to be an ultra-strong grip (compared to others I’ve observed). Here’s where it gets weird, the left hand is so strong that the thumb rests way down into the right palm. It felt so unnatural that I started dropping the left thumb down below the right hand (kinda rests against the bootom of the right hand) Little more info. before everyone flames me here, I am down to a 12 hdcp and am better from tee to green than I am around the green. I can probably drop another 2 to 4 strokes around the green next year just from dedicating more time to the short game (which I plan to do) As far as ball-striking, I am routinely the longest and straightest in my circle of hacker friends and can keep up with the "players" at my local club on most days(usually getting beat around the green). Question: 1.Has anyone ever seen or used this type of grip?? 2.Do you think it is worth the inevitable slump to change ???(with the possibility of never getting back to where I am right now)
Response:
Looking for a little advice. Ever since I started playing (3 years ago) I’ve used what would seem to be an ultra-strong grip (compared to others I’ve observed). Here’s where it gets weird, the left hand is so strong that the thumb rests way down into the right palm. It felt so unnatural that I started dropping the left thumb down below the right hand (kinda rests against the bootom of the right hand) Little more info. before everyone flames me here, I am down to a 12 hdcp and am better from tee to green than I am around the green. I can probably drop another 2 to 4 strokes around the green next year just from dedicating more time to the short game (which I plan to do) As far as ball-striking, I am routinely the longest and straightest in my circle of hacker friends and can keep up with the "players" at my local club on most days(usually getting beat around the green). Question: 1.Has anyone ever seen or used this type of grip?? 2.Do you think it is worth the inevitable slump to change ???(with the possibility of never getting back to where I am right now)