Question:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – You have not really disputed a), in fact confirmed it with a vague reference to low "unit cost" for your newbie series. So unless you want to claim that you can get 4 to 8 -individual- lessons for $100, that point was valid. Yes. Just a slant that I am trying to correct; your bias is that somehow persons do not get enough personal time in that group situation. I have seen LARGE groups here at PCGR get VERY small personal time from staff here, and I deplore that. I do not conduct my classes that way. So I know what you are talking about. But George, you are confirming my implication (which was slight) that you get little individual time (which I never said was "inadequate") in a group lesson. My initial comments, nor subsequent ones, were not directed towards "group lessons by George Hibbard", but about "group lessons". If you want to say that you conduct group lessons in an above average manner so that the student derives great benefit, fine. But as you concede, most group lessons are "lip service".
We’re not talking different at all, Todd. I agree with you. My point in jumping in is that too MANY group lessons are lip service and it doesn’t have to be that way. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – And please tell me you are not saying that you book multiple individual lessons AT THE SAME TIME and move around to others. No. The lesson subject matter is generic and discrete. One cannot ask that the lesson plan for that portion of the day address his individual preference. He must attend to the basic subject. Then he gets personal attention to THAT. ??? Are you talking about inidividual lessons or your golf school? I understand with the school – there is a published curriculum, like a college course, and the instruction will cover the designated subject matter. But surely if I book an individual lesson and want it to cover my wrist cock or my grip, you aren’t going to insist that it be on what -you- want to teach rather than what -I- want to learn?
Of course not. I start with where the pupil presents. Exactly there. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – If this is individual lessons I would prefer to assimilate -between- lessons, or do you pause the meter while you are working with someone ELSE? If I am paying for an individual lesson, I want you there all the time, even if you are well behind and just watching. If for nothing else, I may have a question pop up about the ball I just hit or the swing I just made (which you wouldn’t have seen while working with someone else) or want an answer right now (it may slip my mind after 10 more swings, only to be recalled later that night). I won’t be gone from you for 10 swings, and I do not want you pounding balls withOUT feedback on EVERY shot. No class of mine is large enough for me to miss you unless you are hell bent ON just hitting balls. EVERY SHOT gets YOU to feed back TO YOURSELF what happened and to correct it. Impact chalk is de rigeur. as soon as the points have been made. All do things in unison sometimes and corrections are made in front of all, THEN they go to ball hitting. Hitting balls is not the instruction; it is the testing OF the instruction. And while you work out what you were shown I make the adjustments and tweaks you need TO put the principle in practice. Of course you get ALL THE ATTENTION in a oneonone, but it is not the only format. There is lots of reason people want all day class in a group or school.. Note that I said "if this is individual lessons". We are OK now, just maybe a misunderstanding of the subtle differences between when we were talking about "individual lessons" and "group lessons" and "golf school". And you wanted to stress how superior your lessons are.<g —
No. That a pupil can expect to FIND better if he looks for it. I deplore the large group herd group lessons which are for other purposes than teaching people. GH – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – ToddH Copyright(c) 2001
Response:
#1 – Lessons #2 – (IMO) Momentus I tailed off my use of the Momentus but recently picked it up again, daily. I’m easliy striking balls more effortless since picking it back up again. It helps strengthen the muscles you really use and does indeed help slow down your swing speed… which for me can sometime speed up in a sneaky fashion. ML
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Sorry to ask so many dumb questions. I know that there’s got to be SOMETHING ! I can buy that will help improve my swing. I’ve seen all the commercials on the Golf Channel and all these products have great testimonials(naturally). When I talk to people at the golf shop about them, even though they sell them, I can’t get anything like the ringing endorsement that will make me put down $100 or so. I would really be interested in hearing from anybody that has bought any one of them-good, bad or indifferent. I know I’m going to plunk down for one of them someday, would just like some real experience with them to help me buy the right one.
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – But anyway, I meant the "5 minutes" as a metaphor for "a relatively small fraction of the lesson time", not as a Certified Statistic. If you have a 1 hour group lesson for 10, that’s 6 minutes each (which assumes no time to the group as a whole) . That is not what I meant. That kind of "group lesson" is not a group lesson such as my school format; 3, 4, or 5 days of 5 hours per day plus on-course play Multiple days at 5 hours per day is clearly not what we were talking about. That’s golf "school", not a golf "lesson". However, several years ago But no more? Why not?
Did it until recently. But now am absorbed with the school, private lessons and with other things. There are other local club initiatives for those group classes and it would be "too much" to "compete" with the staff at my own course who conduct those classes. I don’t have the time to do it, frankly. I would have 1 1/2 hour clinics with up to 15 pupils per clinic, and I DID give personal attention to all; the demo and explanation of that day’s subject was shown in the first 10 minutes, with extreme clarity; then I met with those who didn’t "get it" too good and worked with them. So those needing help individually got what they needed. That’s (90 minutes – 10 minutes group) = (80 minutes / 15 students) = 5.33 minutes per student. My initial "5 minutes" was not as off-base as you originally seemed to imply.
Much is accomplished when a single protocol is being put into effect. THe individual doesn’t need the whole magilla each time. He needs correction for misapplication or overlooking of something discussed. A one minute fix. Constant backandforth from pupil to pupil who is working on the same pointer. Takes seconds to tweak, remind, adjust, etc. The explanations are simple and clear; the application to each one is a moment or two, a nod, a move, etc. It is NOT lip service the way I explain. Of course, the time isn’t allotted evenly but on the "squeaky wheel" basis. Still, that involves "luck of the draw" and is unpredictable – maybe the entire class struggles. What then? Do you give them 3 hours?
I give EVERYONE WHAT HE NEEDS and often stay long after "class is dismissed" to help the struggler who shows good faith. If one doesn’t need more than the group demo, maybe they didn’t need the lesson at all?
No. They need it. EVERYONE needs "it" because my "its" are ALWAYS BASICS. Achievement is not about "more" -= it is always about MORE PRECISION IN THE SAME BASICS! An advanced golfer gets the exact same instruction as the newbie; he simply is called to a higher level of precision doing it! To each whatever his capacity. but advanced golfers don’t get different information; just deeper insight into the same things. Those kind of lessons were series of 6 series of 8 etc., at low per unit cost. But they were effective for newbies. $100 for 8?
No. $60. If someone doesn’t practice, it is not a disservice to ignore them in favor of those who do. Why not? Are they charged less? Was that a known pre-condition of their sales contract – that you must do your homework to get what you paid for?
If you don’t practice to be ready for more, you are not entitled to use lesson time for your practice. If you were told what is right and struggle because you did not practice enough for "the next tweak" I am not going to reteach you at the expense of the others who bought into the same format to make up for your delinquency. You seem to be speaking out of character with all that you have said before. Now you are really saying it is OK for a golf teacher to ignore a paying student because he didn’t get to the range between lessons?
No. I am saying that if someone shows no sincere effort to get it that I am not going to punish the conscientious by aborting what they paid for in favor on the delinquent. which is theoretical, anyway. In practice I don’t think I really experienced any delinquents to whom that would apply. Slower pupils get what they need; faster ones get what they need. Someone wanting specialized personal attention will not get it in a group class under the heading "GOlf for Newbies" or whatever the particular classes were entitled. It’s either individual time or it isn’t. You can’t double count. I’m not saying it isn’t helpful, or even advisable. But if you are looking at others in the group and answering their questions, then you aren’t paying full attention to the individual. It may depend in some part on the topic. Putting/chipping seems to be better suited for group instruction than the full swing. Not when basics, the same for all, are being reviewed. This is why review of all swings on video for all to witness is helpful. It is either individual time or it isn’t.
It is both. No one goes away without knowing EXACTLY WHAT the protocol for practice is. Most got written take-home lesson plans too. Much of my book originated FROM those and the first edition was virtually ALL from those LPs. It grew and got refined, but that is where it originated. Again, I never said group lessons were not effective or economical. I’m not sure what you take issue with. All I said was a) $100 for 4 or 8 lessons sounds too cheap to be individual lessons, and b) in a group lesson you only get 5 minutes (or 6 or 7 or even 10) minutes of one-on-one individual time. You have not really disputed a), in fact confirmed it with a vague reference to low "unit cost" for your newbie series. So unless you want to claim that you can get 4 to 8 -individual- lessons for $100, that point was valid.
Yes. Just a slant that I am trying to correct; your bias is that somehow persons do not get enough personal time in that group situation. I have seen LARGE groups here at PCGR get VERY small personal time from staff here, and I deplore that. I do not conduct my classes that way. So I know what you are talking about. I will not take a class too large to give individual and sufficient personal attention for the pupil truly to have a takehome certain protocol to practice. and understood. You somewhat disputed b), saying your group lessons get a "lot" more than that and "plenty" of time, but the lone example breaks out to little more than 5 minutes per student. Please note: nowhere did I say that you NEED more than that. Maybe the part that got you was when I said that without hands-on one might as well buy a book or video. That is essentially what a group lesson (the group part of it, excluding the one-on-one work) is. Further note: my posts did not make reference to "George Hibbard’s group lessons" but to group lessons on average. Yours may be above average, they may be great, but that isn’t relevant to the points I made.
I do agree that most group stuff is lip service, unfortunately. And often extremely ineffective. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – To say the time you give individually constitutes PLENTY of time is a rather bold remark. Plenty for what? To learn the task at hand? If one can get enough personal time in a group lesson, why ever pay for an individual lesson? Price. Group classes in school cost about $20 an hour. Individual costs run $60. And the serious pupil who has been guided well is spending a lot of his time just hitting, testing, trying, AND BEING WATCHED despite my moving around to others. So a one on one lesson is not "in your face" constantly; the pupil MUST BE LEFT ALONE TO DO IT once shown, and that requires me to LEAVE HIM and ALLOW him to be unselfconscious as HE works out what he has just been shown. No comprendo. I asked what would motivate one to book an individual lesson. Price is a motivating factor to book a group lesson. And please tell me you are not saying that you book multiple individual lessons AT THE SAME TIME and move around to others.
No. The lesson subject matter is generic and discrete. One cannot ask that the lesson plan for that portion of the day address his individual preference. He must attend to the basic subject. Then he gets personal attention to THAT. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Books and videos are great. I never said it wasn’t helpful. In fact, I said it was a necessary starting point – build a foundation of learning from course materials and use personal hands-on lesson time to fine tune it. Lots more to good instruction than "doing" and "watch me and fix me". I’ve several times talked here about the lady hostess of the party for celebrity pianists (120 years ago – heard it from my teacher, 40 years ago) – after shaking hands with two pianists who she noted had VERY small hands she burst out -’ Gentlemen, how DO you play so well with such small hands?" Response: "Madam, what makes you think we play the piano with our HANDS?"!!! So golf INFORMATION is what enables, not JUST "doing it". No disagreement here. Overload won’t work, so people need to assimilate, and during YOUR assimilation I am working with someone ELSE. If this is individual lessons I would prefer to assimilate -between- lessons, or do you pause the meter while you are working with someone ELSE? If I am paying for an individual lesson, I want you there all the time, even if you are well behind and just watching. If for nothing else, I may have a question pop up about the ball I just hit or the swing I just made (which you wouldn’t have seen while working with someone else) or want an answer right now (it may slip my mind after 10 more swings, only to be recalled later that night).
I won’t be gone from you for 10 swings, and I do not want you pounding balls withOUT feedback on EVERY shot. No class of mine is
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You -might- get 4 if they are group lessons, but you get about 5 minutes of personal attention in a group. Depends on the group: my group classes are 50 50 and none of them involve enough pupils TO get that kind of short shrift. I don’t know what you mean by "my group classes are 50 50". Do you mean 50% devoted to group demonstration and 50% to individual attention?
Yes, exactly. But anyway, I meant the "5 minutes" as a metaphor for "a relatively small fraction of the lesson time", not as a Certified Statistic. If you have a 1 hour group lesson for 10, that’s 6 minutes each (which assumes no time to the group as a whole) .
That is not what I meant. That kind of "group lesson" is not a group lesson such as my school format; 3, 4, or 5 days of 5 hours per day plus on-course play. However, several years ago I would have 1 1/2 hour clinics with up to 15 pupils per clinic, and I DID give personal attention to all; the demo and explanation of that day’s subject was shown in the first 10 minutes, with extreme clarity; then I met with those who didn’t "get it" too good and worked with them. So those needing help individually got what they needed. Those kind of lessons were series of 6 series of 8 etc., at low per unit cost. But they were effective for newbies. Or advanced clinics for more advanced golfers; trouble with those, however, is that "advanced" in no. of years playing golf often translated into "more deeply embedded errors" and "deafness to correct" ideas. Trying to make wrong right by paying for a lesson and in a sense asking for endorsement of the existing protocol, instead of being open to the change that will help. Usually those open to change will go for at least a lesson or two one on one. Clinic visitees are not given to change… Obviously, the potential individual time is affected by number of students and length of lesson. In reality, the squeaky wheel gets the grease. Individual time is seldom divided equally, in my experience. Rather the ones having the most trouble or asking the most questions get most of the time. Maybe -you- are above that, and make sure everyone gets a fair hands-on.
Squeaky wheel yes, but kudos, support, affirmation, of those with better technique. If someone is striking the ball well he needs VERY LITTLE tweaking to polish his trajectory, impact, or whatever. Like I said, most of the group classes are in series, so it evens out. If someone doesn’t practice, it is not a disservice to ignore them in favor of those who do. Every group class has PLENTY of alone time with each pupil. SUCH IS USED AS A TEACHING TOOL FOR THE REST OF THE GROUP as well as helping the individual. It’s either individual time or it isn’t. You can’t double count. I’m not saying it isn’t helpful, or even advisable. But if you are looking at others in the group and answering their questions, then you aren’t paying full attention to the individual. It may depend in some part on the topic. Putting/chipping seems to be better suited for group instruction than the full swing.
Not when basics, the same for all, are being reviewed. This is why review of all swings on video for all to witness is helpful. To say the time you give individually constitutes PLENTY of time is a rather bold remark. Plenty for what? To learn the task at hand? If one can get enough personal time in a group lesson, why ever pay for an individual lesson?
Price. Group classes in school cost about $20 an hour. Individual costs run $60. And the serious pupil who has been guided well is spending a lot of his time just hitting, testing, trying, AND BEING WATCHED despite my moving around to others. So a one on one lesson is not "in your face" constantly; the pupil MUST BE LEFT ALONE TO DO IT once shown, and that requires me to LEAVE HIM and ALLOW him to be unselfconscious as HE works out what he has just been shown. And the video to which ALL are privy of ALL of the others’ swings is part of the instruction and it is EXTREMELY instruTIVE! Books and videos are great. I never said it wasn’t helpful. In fact, I said it was a necessary starting point – build a foundation of learning from course materials and use personal hands-on lesson time to fine tune it.
Lots more to good instruction than "doing" and "watch me and fix me". I’ve several times talked here about the lady hostess of the party for celebrity pianists (120 years ago – heard it from my teacher, 40 years ago) – after shaking hands with two pianists who she noted had VERY small hands she burst out -’ Gentlemen, how DO you play so well with such small hands?" Response: "Madam, what makes you think we play the piano with our HANDS?"!!! So golf INFORMATION is what enables, not JUST "doing it". Logic, understanding, making the picture clear, geometry, measurement, impact behavior, physics principles explained in everyday images (playground swing, car towing car, fishing pole, broom, slingshot, bike wheel, wagon wheel, towel snapping), etc. ALL IN CONTEXT. Overload won’t work, so people need to assimilate, and during YOUR assimilation I am working with someone ELSE. Blanket statements need qualification. It wasn’t intended to be a blanket statement. Group lessons can be a great deal and quite economical, especially if the group is small. But when we talk about "lessons" here we are generally talking about individual lessons, unless noted otherwise. I was just pointing out that I didn’t think the previous statement that you could get 4 to 8 lessons for $100 could possibly be referring to individual lessons. Even if you could, I’d wonder about the qualifications of a teacher that would give me 30 minutes or more for $12.
Of course. Problem is that is all many of them are really worth….. GH – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – — ToddH Copyright(c) 2001
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I don’t think simply adding weight to an old club would duplicate the Momentus. The weight (48 oz) is distributed along the shaft. The club is also 5" shorter than normal club. You are supposed to hover the club at address. I don’t know why everytime someone asks about new vs old or asks about trainers most of the hacks here poo poo it all. How many scratch golfers do you see carrying a set of knock-offs or $15.00 putters. Of course there are exceptions but most of the time they play with name brand clubs and top of the line fitted shafts. Brian
Brian: it is fairly well known that "brand name" sets often contain mismatched shafts, improperly bent lies and lofts, etc. No matter the price. And in the last few months I have witnessed or heard firsthand of the breaking of 6 Ping drivers. Three returned by a single golfer; one by a Qschool candidate in the middle of his round, and two others in a one week period right at my teaching station! So much for brand names. It is worthless as a standard. Quality is often visible on inspection. Doesn’t apply to all clubs, but to too many! Many component sources have higher quality control. GH – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I bought the Momentus swing trainer a couple of months ago. It is a good solid product and has helped me with Tempo, flexability and strength. 15-20 minutes is a really good workout. Be sure to follow the instructions on the tape. You can develop some really bad swing patterns if you don’t. Like hitting fat shots. I also don’t recommend using it as a warm-up before playing. Brian Adding weight to the head of an old club will also create a heavy, feedback-giving, hardtoswing club, and I see little difference offered by a club thingee whose feature is simply a matter of weight from my version of it. If the momentus in question has some kind of hinged joint that folds under certain conditions, possibly that would add information about one’s swing; my experience with one 5 iron with a hinge in it was quite negative as not everyone’s preference for backswing is going to work well with it. The best backswings are SWINGS, not "puts", and that club didn’t work with that protocol. However, I find that a heavy club is extremely good for training when it is swung carefully and slowly. George Hibbard
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I am serious… for $100, you can buy a package from a pro of anywhere from 4 to 8 lessons. Where?! Sign me up!!! You -might- get 4 if they are group lessons, but you get about 5 minutes of personal attention in a group.
Depends on the group: my group classes are 50 50 and none of them involve enough pupils TO get that kind of short shrift. Every group class has PLENTY of alone time with each pupil. SUCH IS USED AS A TEACHING TOOL FOR THE REST OF THE GROUP as well as helping the individual. And the video to which ALL are privy of ALL of the others’ swings is part of the instruction and it is EXTREMELY instruTIVE! FWIW. Blanket statements need qualification. George Hibbard – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Without the personal hands-on, you might as well buy a video or book. — ToddH Copyright(c) 2001
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I don’t think simply adding weight to an old club would duplicate the Momentus. The weight (48 oz) is distributed along the shaft. The club is also 5" shorter than normal club. You are supposed to hover the club at address. I don’t know why everytime someone asks about new vs old or asks about trainers most of the hacks here poo poo it all.
As one involved on a daily basis with pupils, protocols, devices and their effectiveness, I sort out the substantive from the appearances. If a diamond costing a wholesaler $100 is marketed and resold for $1000, the impression given is that the diamond is "worth" $1000. But someone in the know will not pay $1000 for it. I do not pay $400 for a quality club that either I or someone else puts together from quality components costing $30. The VCR you get at Walmart model xxrrff from XYZ in the blue box for $59.88 is the same vcr you get at the other store for $159.88. How many scratch golfers do you see carrying a set of knock-offs or $15.00 putters.
Not talking crap. Of course there are exceptions but most of the time they play with name brand clubs and top of the line fitted shafts.
Gimmicky, even quality made gimmicky aids, are deceptive in that they purport to "teaching" the golfer something. A five minute instruction teaches him more. We do not agree. George Hibbard – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Brian I bought the Momentus swing trainer a couple of months ago. It is a good solid product and has helped me with Tempo, flexability and strength. 15-20 minutes is a really good workout. Be sure to follow the instructions on the tape. You can develop some really bad swing patterns if you don’t. Like hitting fat shots. I also don’t recommend using it as a warm-up before playing. Brian Adding weight to the head of an old club will also create a heavy, feedback-giving, hardtoswing club, and I see little difference offered by a club thingee whose feature is simply a matter of weight from my version of it. If the momentus in question has some kind of hinged joint that folds under certain conditions, possibly that would add information about one’s swing; my experience with one 5 iron with a hinge in it was quite negative as not everyone’s preference for backswing is going to work well with it. The best backswings are SWINGS, not "puts", and that club didn’t work with that protocol. However, I find that a heavy club is extremely good for training when it is swung carefully and slowly. George Hibbard
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Sorry to ask so many dumb questions. I know that there’s got to be SOMETHING ! I can buy that will help improve my swing.
There is. Range balls. Chris
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I don’t think simply adding weight to an old club would duplicate the Momentus. The weight (48 oz) is distributed along the shaft. The club is also 5" shorter than normal club. You are supposed to hover the club at address. I don’t know why everytime someone asks about new vs old or asks about trainers most of the hacks here poo poo it all. How many scratch golfers do you see carrying a set of knock-offs or $15.00 putters. Of course there are exceptions but most of the time they play with name brand clubs and top of the line fitted shafts. Brian – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I bought the Momentus swing trainer a couple of months ago. It is a good solid product and has helped me with Tempo, flexability and strength. 15-20 minutes is a really good workout. Be sure to follow the instructions on the tape. You can develop some really bad swing patterns if you don’t. Like hitting fat shots. I also don’t recommend using it as a warm-up before playing. Brian Adding weight to the head of an old club will also create a heavy, feedback-giving, hardtoswing club, and I see little difference offered by a club thingee whose feature is simply a matter of weight from my version of it. If the momentus in question has some kind of hinged joint that folds under certain conditions, possibly that would add information about one’s swing; my experience with one 5 iron with a hinge in it was quite negative as not everyone’s preference for backswing is going to work well with it. The best backswings are SWINGS, not "puts", and that club didn’t work with that protocol. However, I find that a heavy club is extremely good for training when it is swung carefully and slowly. George Hibbard
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if not the gadgets….what you do guys recommend some of us do during the winter months when it is too cold to golf?
That’s easy…bring a cot and sleep in my garage..and keep playing golf!!! Dave Clary/Corpus Christi,TX http://home.stx.rr.com/dclary RSG Roll Call http://u1.netgate.net/~kirby34/rsg/claryd.htm
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You didn’t say what it is about your swing that you are trying to improve. I have bought two "gadgets" that are cheap and very effective. The first is a weight that attaches to the end of any club. It weighs from 1/4 to 1 1/4 pounds, depending on whether or not you remove any individual weights. I got it in a golf store, and it costs $20. This is a much better product than the Momentus. For one, you can use it on any club, and keep the characteristics of that club; i.e shaft length and grip. Secondly, you can attach it on any place on the shaft, to vary the lesson. You can use it on a putter. I use it to help my muscles remember the proper feel of the left side ( lower body) starting the downswing. The sheer weight of the club forces my lower body weight to shift as I get to the top of the backswing. It is also helpful for the backswing. If the swing is not correct the weight of the club makes it difficult to hold. The second gadget cost me $10. It is a band that fits around my upper arms and forces me to take away the club in the classic triangle one-piece takeaway. Additionally, it will not allow me to increse the space between my arms at the top of the backswing. Neither, will it allow my elbow to bow out. It also keeps my one piece swing together on the downswing and follow through. Some gadgets on the market are worthwhile, and they don’t have to cost an arm and a leg. I feel the weight alone is like having 5 Momentus trainers.
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if not the gadgets….what you do guys recommend some of us do during the winter months when it is too cold to golf? lloyd
Learn the core motion of the release of the club, the grip required to allow it, the stance which will allow a good turn, and the sequencing of the entire swing, and practice THAT. Also practice hitting whiffle balls with your left arm alone, standing mostly on your left leg, and STARTING WITH A TOTAL/COMPLETE 90 DEGREE WRISTCOCK. Use a short club, put the balls under your chin , hang your left arm straight down. With small VERTICAL BACKSWINGS at first using a very shortened club, taking the club straight back and straight up in the air, to train yourself to use your left arm STRAIGHT DOWN TO THE BALL AND STRAIGHT ALONG THE TARGET LINE. Devices are NOT going to teach you what to do. YOU are going to teach you what to do. And that involves getting on plane, staying on plane, understanding the core of the GOLF swing as the release of the "L" of the cocked wrist, and DOING JUST THAT until you live it, breathe it, and know it the same as you know how to ride your bike. IT IS THE CORE upon which EVERYTHING else is built golfswing! George Hibbard www.perfectimpact.com
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if not the gadgets….what you do guys recommend some of us do during the winter months when it is too cold to golf? lloyd
Gadgets can really get you messed up if you go a long time without seeing what kind of shots the swing you are grooving is producing. It is best to just hang up the clubs and take a break from golf for a while and start over when the weather permits. IMHO In the spring go out and play 4 or 5 rounds and then take a lesson to work out any lingering kinks.
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if not the gadgets….what you do guys recommend some of us do during the winter months when it is too cold to golf? lloyd
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I bought the Momentus swing trainer a couple of months ago. It is a good solid product and has helped me with Tempo, flexability and strength. 15-20 minutes is a really good workout. Be sure to follow the instructions on the tape. You can develop some really bad swing patterns if you don’t. Like hitting fat shots. I also don’t recommend using it as a warm-up before playing. Brian
Adding weight to the head of an old club will also create a heavy, feedback-giving, hardtoswing club, and I see little difference offered by a club thingee whose feature is simply a matter of weight from my version of it. If the momentus in question has some kind of hinged joint that folds under certain conditions, possibly that would add information about one’s swing; my experience with one 5 iron with a hinge in it was quite negative as not everyone’s preference for backswing is going to work well with it. The best backswings are SWINGS, not "puts", and that club didn’t work with that protocol. However, I find that a heavy club is extremely good for training when it is swung carefully and slowly. George Hibbard
Response:
I bought the Momentus swing trainer a couple of months ago. It is a good solid product and has helped me with Tempo, flexability and strength. 15-20 minutes is a really good workout. Be sure to follow the instructions on the tape. You can develop some really bad swing patterns if you don’t. Like hitting fat shots. I also don’t recommend using it as a warm-up before playing. Brian – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Sorry to ask so many dumb questions. I know that there’s got to be SOMETHING ! I can buy that will help improve my swing. I’ve seen all the commercials on the Golf Channel and all these products have great testimonials(naturally). When I talk to people at the golf shop about them, even though they sell them, I can’t get anything like the ringing endorsement that will make me put down $100 or so. I would really be interested in hearing from anybody that has bought any one of them-good, bad or indifferent. I know I’m going to plunk down for one of them someday, would just like some real experience with them to help me buy the right one.
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -Sorry to ask so many dumb questions. I know that there’s got to be SOMETHING ! I can buy that will help improve my swing. I’ve seen all the commercials on the Golf Channel and all these products have great testimonials(naturally). When I talk to people at the golf shop about them, even though they sell them, I can’t get anything like the ringing endorsement that will make me put down $100 or so. I would really be interested in hearing from anybody that has bought any one of them-good, bad or indifferent. I know I’m going to plunk down for one of them someday, would just like some real experience with them to help me buy the right one.
Re: Kallassy swing magic: use a toilet paper tube on the shaft of a 5-Iron. Voil