becoming a pilot

Question:

I imagine brass monkeys were valuable items in their time, and probably still are as collectable antiques. So your momma’s expression actually makes sense!

Where else but here could you learn such things? :) Thanks for sharing. — Jay Honeck Iowa City, IA Warrior N33431

Response:

The problem is that brass and iron have different coeficients of expansion. In cold weather the brass hoops contracted more than the iron cannonballs, so the cannon balls would "fall" off the bass monkey.

I assume you mean that the brass hoops contracted LESS than the iron cannonballs. Even so, the story sounds pretty fishy to me. The cannonballs would have to be on the verge of falling through the hoops in the first place for the small difference in expansion/contraction to make them fall through. Pete

Response:

Even so, the story sounds pretty fishy to me. The cannonballs would have to be on the verge of falling through the hoops in the first place for the small difference in expansion/contraction to make them fall through.

Looks like you’re right: http://www.history.navy.mil/faqs/faq107.htm –TWH

Response:

There are a number of exercises you can employ to help you to prepare for your PPL course that will greatly enhance the experience and make the learning process more efficient. Flying is one of those endeavours where details are important and close enough just doesn’t cut it. Hand-eye coordination is also important. You can develop both of those traits by practicing the use of the shift key. Don — Wm. Donald (Don) Tabor Jr., DDS PP-ASEL Chesapeake, VA – CPK, PVG

Response:

1 – is it possible/reasonable to obtain a license in about 12 wks or so

Easily… barring the usual things like weather, terrorists attacks, and slipping and breaking your leg. 2 – my next question is where do i go to learn? i am originally from texas (west texas as in el paso but have family all over that great state

You will find schools all over. If you like El Paso, then you do have the advantage of the weather probably not being a factor (sun, broken by random periods of sun). If you are around El Paso, check with Sue A. Critz. She’s a very good flight instructor there at ELP. 3 – is flying really all it’s cracked up to be?

That’s something I can’t answer *for you.* For me, yes… definitely. I suggest you give Sue a holler: Sue Critz 6825 Convair Rd # 1 El Paso, TX 79925 915-771-6655 and ask her about a "Discovery" (i.e. introductory) flight. This will give you a better feel than anything I can tell you here. Meanwhile, I would also suggest a book "Weekend Wings" by Frank Kingston Smith. Not about the technology of flight, but rather a book about his life and how being a general aviation pilot impacted it. It will give you a good feel for what it’s all about. jmk — James M. Knox TriSoft ph 512-385-0316 1109-A Shady Lane fax 512-366-4331

Response:

2 – my next question is where do i go to learn? i am originally from texas (west texas as in el paso but have family all over that great state and Sue Crit in El Paso is one of the best.

"Sue Critz"; and yes, I recommend her highly. [And I still owe her a steak dinner. <G] jmk James M. Knox TriSoft ph 512-385-0316 1109-A Shady Lane fax 512-366-4331

Response:

12 weeks is roughly 3 months, and that’s plenty of time if you’re really going at it "full time" and the weather coorporates. The question is your definition of "full time"and how committed you are to aviation. If you really like flying that much, and you really actually spend about 8 hours a day either studying or flying, there is no reason not to be able to get it in a month. But this is the only factor you have control of. To give you an idea, I started training in mid June flying roughly twice a week for about 1.7 hours each time. Sometimes I flew 3 times a week when the weather is really nice and I was able to ditch work. I was ready for the checkride by early September. but… As you will surely learn once you start flying, that there are many other things that will keep you grounded and make you frustrated. This include weather, airplane (unexpected maintainance, repairs, etc), and all sorts of unexpected things happening around you (family, girlfriend, even events like Sept 11 which kept me grounded for over a month since I live in NYC). So the best thing would be to make sure you spend alot of time before each lesson studying and preparing for the particular lesson and the license. What can help you immensely (atleast it did for me) was to be able to tape record each lesson. I was able to put together a camera/tripod setup in the back of the 152 wired up to the intercom so I can go home and review my flight (especially landings) from a 3rd person view. It is also much easier to hear what the CFI is telling you to do when you just have to watch someone else do it in the tape. If video taping is not possible, definitely try to voice record the intercom. As with rock collecting… well, I guess if you wanna join the geeks club instead of becoming a mile-high club inductor… best, Jeff T. PP-ASEL

Response:

Yes, you can do it in twelve weeks if you do it full time with one dedicated instructor. You’ll have to average about an hour a day in the air, and an hour or two on the ground studying. It will help if you’ve had experience with sailing, or model airplanes — something that has given you an appreciation for the way air flows. before you start, read Stick & Rudder by Wolfgang Langewiesche — still the best introduction to the mysteries. And remember that light aircraft are often called "doctor killers." Seth N8100R

Response:

I think for you, it sounds like yes, it will be. However, believe it or not, there are some people out there who have taken a lesson or two and decided that they didn’t really have that much interest in flying. They had been attracted to it by the challenge, or maybe with a specific goal of transportation, rather than by any genuine passion for flying, and been disappointed.

In my experience, very few people find flying boring or disappointing after a lesson or two. This may be what they announce publicly, after quitting, but it ain’t what they will tell you in private. Alone, in a quiet bar, after a few drinks, more than one has confessed to me that something scared them, or they didn’t think they’d ever be able to do it. I’ve heard others say that they just couldn’t afford it. One acquaintance had to quit lessons when his wife found out what he was doing with all that money. If Momma ain’t happy, ain’t NOBODY happy. Bottom line: There are any number of legitimate reasons to quit flying . But if you find flying anything but exciting and challenging, you’re dead from the neck up. — Jay Honeck Iowa City, IA Warrior N33431

Response:

You can develop both of those traits by practicing the use of the

shift key. Haw haw! Good one! — Dan N9387D at BFM

Response:

hello again! thanks for all the replies! from what i have gathered by the responses: 1 – i should have a PPL by the end of the coming summer providing i put in enough full time hours 2 – i learned that sue critz comes highly recommended if el paso, tx is where i am to receive my training 3 – In order to become a successful pilot I need to capitalize proper nouns and the beginning word in each new sentence. This last one may take a little time any other advice is appreciated, feel free to email me or just post to this thread as i read this board everyday (i find it very inspiring). thanks again. chris – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – hi everyone! i was hoping someone could help me with a few questions i have about obtaining a private pilot certificate. i have been interested in becoming a pilot for as far back as i can remember and recently decided that i would take the plunge and go for it. however i am limited on time as i am still in school (boston university school of medicine) and will only really have one last "free" summer to pursue other interests. i wanted to get my ducks in a row if going for a ppl is truly possible. so it is with this that i come to you for help with these questions: 1 – is it possible/reasonable to obtain a license in about 12 wks or so if this is pursued as a full-time venture? i have read the various guidelines and national averages for flight/ground school time but these figures don’t help me much as they only discuss the minimum and average hours required and with no mention of how hard/easy it is to get these hours in (accounting for delays due to scheduling, weather, aircraft availability). the last thing i want to do is rush through something that i consider to be very important. is it reasonable to expect to schedule and accomplish the required tasks within this time period? 2 – my next question is where do i go to learn? i am originally from texas (west texas as in el paso but have family all over that great state and the options i have narrowed myself down to are schools in the el paso/southwest region or something in san antonio/austin area, as those two locales will find me sheltered and fed while in flight school. does anyone in the area have any suggestions as to what schools i should look into in either of the regions? presently i’m looking at a school in san antonio located at http://www.wrightflyers.com what are some things i need to keep in mind when selecting a school that i might not be aware of? 3 – is flying really all it’s cracked up to be? or should i just save my money and find another less expensive and adventurous hobby like perhaps rock collecting? (no offense to rock collectors as i’m sure there is adventure in anything you do if you do it right) [this last question is rhetorical, i'm sure we all --including us non-pilots-- know the answer to this] thanks, in advance, for your help cre

Response:

1 – is it possible/reasonable to obtain a license in about 12 wks or so if this is pursued as a full-time venture?

Yes, I did it back in ‘69 as part of an ROTC program — I flew between attending classes. I flew twice during the week and twice on Sunday. Personally, I think this is the only way to go. If you try to spread it out too much, you will forget what you’ve learned between lessons. I started my flying in mid-September and got my license the day after Thanksgiving. 2 – my next question is where do i go to learn? ihave narrowed myself down to are schools in the el paso/southwest region or something in san antonio/austin area,

You may have some wind related problems, but otherwise the weather should cooperate. Good thing you aren’t trying this in the south east. Morning = Fog, Afternoon = Thunderstorms. (My AF pilot training was at Moody AFB, by the big "O" in "Okeefenokee." 3 – is flying really all it’s cracked up to be?

I know that this is not a serious question, so I won’t bother answering it . Dan Flak I am not older than dirt. I just beta tested it.

Response:

Yeah…what everyone else said. Also keep up with this group and especially rec.aviation.student . I’m still learning from these groups! Best Wishes, Rodney PP-ASEL

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – hi everyone! i was hoping someone could help me with a few questions i have about obtaining a private pilot certificate. i have been interested in becoming a pilot for as far back as i can remember and recently decided that i would take the plunge and go for it. however i am limited on time as i am still in school (boston university school of medicine) and will only really have one last "free" summer to pursue other interests. i wanted to get my ducks in a row if going for a ppl is truly possible. so it is with this that i come to you for help with these questions: 1 – is it possible/reasonable to obtain a license in about 12 wks or so if this is pursued as a full-time venture? i have read the various guidelines and national averages for flight/ground school time but these figures don’t help me much as they only discuss the minimum and average hours required and with no mention of how hard/easy it is to get these hours in (accounting for delays due to scheduling, weather, aircraft availability). the last thing i want to do is rush through something that i consider to be very important. is it reasonable to expect to schedule and accomplish the required tasks within this time period? 2 – my next question is where do i go to learn? i am originally from texas (west texas as in el paso but have family all over that great state and the options i have narrowed myself down to are schools in the el paso/southwest region or something in san antonio/austin area, as those two locales will find me sheltered and fed while in flight school. does anyone in the area have any suggestions as to what schools i should look into in either of the regions? presently i’m looking at a school in san antonio located at http://www.wrightflyers.com what are some things i need to keep in mind when selecting a school that i might not be aware of? 3 – is flying really all it’s cracked up to be? or should i just save my money and find another less expensive and adventurous hobby like perhaps rock collecting? (no offense to rock collectors as i’m sure there is adventure in anything you do if you do it right) [this last question is rhetorical, i'm sure we all --including us non-pilots-- know the answer to this] thanks, in advance, for your help cre

Response:

3 – In order to become a successful pilot I need to capitalize proper nouns and the beginning word in each new sentence. This last one may take a little time

No, you need to cultivate the habit of doing things right even when you can get by with less. Laziness in little things leads to smoking holes more often than lack of skill or intelligence. Don — Wm. Donald (Don) Tabor Jr., DDS PP-ASEL Chesapeake, VA – CPK, PVG

Response:

Hi- I was able to get my PPL in just over 4 months "part-time" while working more than fulltime. This includes the delays due to the unfortunate September 11th tragedies. I live just west of Boston and went to KFIT (www.fcaflight.com). If you do decide to take lessons in the Boston area, I would highly recommend them, just a ride on the T from Boston, although probably a long one. The whole experience cost me about $4500 or so. While rock collecting has been known to be an exhilarating, breathtaking hobby to some, I personally have to say, getting the PPL is a truly unbelievable experience. I think it was one of the best choices I have made. I’ve had my license about 1 week. As I tell my wife, we’re not doing this to save money…. Good luck! Brett

Response:

I did mine in about 3.5 months at 4hrs/week. You should be able to do it in 12 weeks easily – baring weather problems. 2 – my next question is where do i go to learn?

Here in Pierre, SD we probably have some of the longest sunny periods in US. Just check the national weather picture and you will see that most storms from west miss us and Gulf of Mexico stuff does not come here. The main instructor (Forest) here has been teaching flying for 15 years. And they only charge $42/hr for C150 ($52/hr C172) and $20/15 for instructor. You can contact them at 605-224-9000 (tell them I sent you). 3 – is flying really all it’s cracked up to be?

Thats something you decide but the least I think it is a useful skill – emergency travel, travel w/o airport inspections, freedom, etc. Paul Lee …

Response:

3 – is flying really all it’s cracked up to be?

It’s expensive, it’s complicated, it can be difficult, it is more dangerous than sitting in your recliner watching TV, I’ve squandered countless valuable dollars on flying and airplanes since 1955, I’ve ‘wasted’ untold hours hanging around airports, it can be a lousy way to travel…what’d I leave out?? But I wouldn’t trade it for a brass monkey.. :-) (I’m not sure what that ‘brass monkey’ comment really means but my Momma used to say it in the same context, so it must be OK…)

Response:

3 – is flying really all it’s cracked up to be?

..what’d I leave out?? Well, you left out that all of your nonflying ‘friends’ cross the street when they see you coming… <umm, pilots don’t actually have friends who don’t fly, but you get my point Your spouse has the choice of wearing a new dress to the office christmas party, or paying the hangar rent… Your don’t find the movie "Airport" to be funny… You can’t watch a tv show that has an airplane in it without being disgusted by their ignorance…. You hang your head out the car window, like a dog going for a ride, to watch a low flying plane cross the highway just above you… You say things like, "Jeez, the density altitude has to be high today.", that get you lots of raised eyebrows and tapping of temples by people around you… You have holes in your shoes and frayed trouser cuffs as you are telling the guy working next to you about your $5,000 IFR GPS receiver…. Your wife never has to think twice about where to call when you don’t show up on time for supper… Your watch is big enough to choke an alligator and has lots of dials and knobs… You could stump a petroleum engineer with comparisons about low temperature viscosity and wetting charateristics of mineral oil versus synthetics…. And on, and on….

Response:

3 – is flying really all it’s cracked up to be? It’s expensive, it’s complicated, it can be difficult, it is more dangerous than sitting in your recliner watching TV, I’ve squandered countless valuable dollars on flying and airplanes since 1955, I’ve ‘wasted’ untold hours hanging around airports, it can be a lousy way to travel…what’d I leave out?? But I wouldn’t trade it for a brass monkey.. :-) (I’m not sure what that ‘brass monkey’ comment really means but my Momma used to say it in the same context, so it must be OK…)

Yes. we’ve heard the expression "cold enough to frezze the balls off a brass monkey." Sounds a little on the vulgar side, but it isn’t. On British warships in the early days, cannon balls were carted to the cannon on a device that held the cannon balls in iron hoops on the bottom. From the middle of the hoops stood a vertical bar. This bar had a crooked top so a couple of seamen could put a pole under it and lift the stack of cannon balls. The curved top resembled a monkey’s tail, so it was called a "monkey." The British Navy, being the British Navy had "cerimonial" versions of the monkey made out of brass (as if there weren’t enough brass on a man-of-war to polish) for inspections. The problem is that brass and iron have different coeficients of expansion. In cold weather the brass hoops contracted more than the iron cannonballs, so the cannon balls would "fall" off the bass monkey. I imagine brass monkeys were valuable items in their time, and probably still are as collectable antiques. So your momma’s expression actually makes sense! Dan Flak I am not older than dirt. I just beta tested it.

Response:

3 – is flying really all it’s cracked up to be? Well, you left out that all of your nonflying ‘friends’ cross the street when they see you coming… <umm, pilots don’t actually have friends who don’t fly, but you get my point Your spouse has the choice of wearing a new dress to the office christmas party, or paying the hangar rent… Your don’t find the movie "Airport" to be funny…

Naw, naw, you still find the movie "Airport" and "Airplane!" funney, but for all the WRONG reasons. You’ll just be laughing in all the right/wrong places (depending on how you look at it) You can’t watch a tv show that has an airplane in it without being disgusted by their ignorance…. You hang your head out the car window, like a dog going for a ride, to watch a low flying plane cross the highway just above you…

You’ll often find yourself almost causing accidents on the freeway when driving by even the smallest of airports. You say things like, "Jeez, the density altitude has to be high today.", that get you lots of raised eyebrows and tapping of temples by people around you… You have holes in your shoes and frayed trouser cuffs as you are telling the guy working next to you about your $5,000 IFR GPS receiver…. Your wife never has to think twice about where to call when you don’t show up on time for supper…

Reminds me of a joke: An Air Force pilot walks into a tavern, has a few drinks when he spies a comely lass sitting alone at the far side of the bar. Deftly he slips his wedding ring off and into a pocket as he orders her a drink. He goes over to talk to her, this leads to that leads to a trip back to her apartment. Before he leaves, he puts on his flight suit, kisses her good night and heads off for home. On the way he splashes some Jet-A on his flight suit an d stands in front of the exauhst for a few minutes. Before he goes inside, he puts on his O2 mask and seals it tight for a minute. He gets inside late to find his wife waiting up for him on the couch. He looks at her, and confesses the whole story. The bar, the young lady, the one night stand. All of it. To which his wife looks at him, frowns and yells back "Don’t lie to me, you’ve been flying that damned airplane again!" – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Your watch is big enough to choke an alligator and has lots of dials and knobs… You could stump a petroleum engineer with comparisons about low temperature viscosity and wetting charateristics of mineral oil versus synthetics…. And on, and on….

Response:

hi everyone! i was hoping someone could help me with a few questions i have about obtaining a private pilot certificate. i have been interested in becoming a pilot for as far back as i can remember and recently decided that i would take the plunge and go for it. however i am limited on time as i am still in school (boston university school of medicine) and will only really have one last "free" summer to pursue other interests. i wanted to get my ducks in a row if going for a ppl is truly possible. so it is with this that i come to you for help with these questions: 1 – is it possible/reasonable to obtain a license in about 12 wks or so if this is pursued as a full-time venture? i have read the various guidelines and national averages for flight/ground school time but these figures don’t help me much as they only discuss the minimum and average hours required and with no mention of how hard/easy it is to get these hours in (accounting for delays due to scheduling, weather, aircraft availability). the last thing i want to do is rush through something that i consider to be very important. is it reasonable to expect to schedule and accomplish the required tasks within this time period? 2 – my next question is where do i go to learn? i am originally from texas (west texas as in el paso but have family all over that great state and the options i have narrowed myself down to are schools in the el paso/southwest region or something in san antonio/austin area, as those two locales will find me sheltered and fed while in flight school. does anyone in the area have any suggestions as to what schools i should look into in either of the regions? presently i’m looking at a school in san antonio located at http://www.wrightflyers.com what are some things i need to keep in mind when selecting a school that i might not be aware of? 3 – is flying really all it’s cracked up to be? or should i just save my money and find another less expensive and adventurous hobby like perhaps rock collecting? (no offense to rock collectors as i’m sure there is adventure in anything you do if you do it right) [this last question is rhetorical, i'm sure we all --including us non-pilots-- know the answer to this] thanks, in advance, for your help cre

Response:

1 – is it possible/reasonable to obtain a license in about 12 wks or so if this is pursued as a full-time venture?

Yes, unless you get a *really* unlucky stretch of weather. It’ll be a lot of work, and you’ll want to do some studying beforehand. But assuming your existing course load can accomodate some additional study time for aviation topics, it’s doable. Given your time restriction, I would try to find a school where the weather is consistently good, and where they have a large fleet (so that mechanical problems don’t delay you). 2 – my next question is where do i go to learn?

I dunno anything about schools in Texas. However, the Flight Training Magazine web site has a searchable database that should be helpful: http://www.flighttrainingmag.com/school/index.cfm For that matter, I haven’t had a chance to read their site thoroughly, but at a first glance, it appears that they have a lot of good, useful information for you. Try this link for starters: http://www.flighttrainingmag.com/learntofly/index.cfm 3 – is flying really all it’s cracked up to be? or should i just save my money and find another less expensive and adventurous hobby like perhaps rock collecting? [...] [this last question is rhetorical, i'm sure we all -- including us non-pilots-- know the answer to this]

Heh, you *think* it’s a rhetorical question. :) I think for you, it sounds like yes, it will be. However, believe it or not, there are some people out there who have taken a lesson or two and decided that they didn’t really have that much interest in flying. They had been attracted to it by the challenge, or maybe with a specific goal of transportation, rather than by any genuine passion for flying, and been disappointed. In case the Flight Training Magazine web site doesn’t mention it (though I’ll bet they do), one thing you should look for is demo flights with the schools you’re considering. For somewhere between $30-50, you should be able to get an introductory lesson with one of the schools instructors, in one of their planes. Do this for as many schools as you are considering. It will help you decide which school (and instructor) you like best, and it will also help you be sure of whether you will really enjoy flying or not, without having to invest a huge amount of money (usually an hour lesson can cost $100 or more, for the airplane and instructor). Pete

Response:

It is possible to get your pilot certificate in the time you describe. You should discuss matters of aircraft and instructor availability as well as whether or not the weather is likely to permit you to finish within your time constraints with your local flight instructor. After you learn to fly you should still plan on flying fairly regularly to keep current, so put that in your time budget. Some of the busiest people in the world manage to find time to fly. Your choice of flight school is largely determined by your budget for both time and money, as well as personal preferences. Obviously, the more money you can devote to learning to fly the nicer the airplanes and other facilities will be. Get too cheap and you could end up losing much of your investment when the flight school goes out of business or you could find that the planes simply aren’t in very good condition. Take an introductory flight with the school. The closer the school is to your home the less time you spend commuting and the more time you spend flying. The introductory flight will also tell you whether you like flying or not. The important question here is why do you want to fly? If you have a real transportation need then you can plan accordingly. A pilot certificate can give a medical professional enormous flexibility. People also fly because they like the challenge. Some pilots love to accumulate ratings and certificates — they love the process of learning. Others simply enjoy the sense of freedom — there really is something about soaring above a miles long traffic jam. Taking a floatplane to a quiet lake for a weekend of fishing, flying to a golf resort, a sunset dinner trip, or just going for a $100 hamburger are all reasons to fly. I like to visit my grandchildren in Idaho; the flight takes 3 hours each way, but all day if I drive. If these things are what you expect flying to be, then flying is all it is cracked up to be. Visit rec.aviation.student. Lots of tips on learning to fly there.

Response:

2 – my next question is where do i go to learn? i am originally from texas (west texas as in el paso but have family all over that great state and

Sue Crit in El Paso is one of the best.

Response:

If you are young & healthy & sharp (as I hope you are, if you are going to be operating on me some day) you should certainly be able to do just that. And God knows you won’t have time to pursue it when you are a resident! You will want to find a nearby airport and a good instructor and work out a plan. If you fly five days a week for an hour, you can in theory get 60 hours’ flying in 12 weeks. That ought to be plenty. You can shave it a bit by getting a recreational certificate, figuring on upgrading it later. (This works best if you are flying in the boondocks and can do without Class D airspace, or if you are happy flying in and out of just the one airport you’re training at.) You are wise to start now. I’d get the DVD or other video programs and the books now so you will have the basic knowledge down pat before you start. You might also want to go for your medical / student certificate so that is out of the way. Good luck! see the Warbird’s Forum at http://danford.net Jihad | Flying Tigers | Pacific War | Brewster Buffalo | Piper Cub

Response:

Hello everyone, I am a 22 year old dutch aircraft maintenance student, and I am hoping to become a professional pilot. I will be an official Dutch A&P in about May 1999, and it would be easy for me to obtain my American qualifications. But I want tobe a pilot. I was just wondering if there are some pilots here who could share me some of their experiences with being a professional pilot. What fligh school do you recommend, what is the best way to mkae a career when you’re a pilot? Do you have any advice?? Thanks a lot! Jan-Willem Tulp

Response:

I have a website that discusses becoming a professinoal pilot: http://www.mindspring.com/~dltaylor Doug Taylor 727

: Hello everyone, : I am a 22 year old dutch aircraft maintenance student, and I am hoping to : become a professional pilot. I will be an official Dutch A&P in about May : 1999, and it would be easy for me to obtain my American qualifications. But : I want tobe a pilot. I was just wondering if there are some pilots here who : could share me some of their experiences with being a professional pilot. : What fligh school do you recommend, what is the best way to mkae a career : when you’re a pilot? Do you have any advice?? Thanks a lot! : Jan-Willem Tulp

Response:

try a school under the aviation company such as Comair, United Airlines and Northwest Airlines. a

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