Question:
Hi F. Roh, Thank you for your insight. It is a pleasure exchanging ideas with you. And you point is?
I’m not sure. Let me think about it a little while longer…. <G If I told you Nolan Ryan is not an alcoholic and that was one of the reasons why he was a major league pitcher for twenty years, would you disagree with me?
No, I wouldn’t disagree with you, but if Nolan Ryan WAS an alchoholic (whatever that is) and he still was a major league pitcher for twenty years I wouldn’t say that he could’ve pitched for thirty if he wasn’t. Let me reiterate what I said about Daly: he is a champion caliber professional. He can win any tourney on any given day on any course. He has been gifted with innate talent that has taken him far. But he could go much further if he can control his drinking. And it’s not drinking to celebrate his winnings, but drinking every night of the week, drinking in the morning before starting his round, drinking packs of beer and staying up all night,…etc.
See my answer above. I respect your opinion, but we as sport s fans need to give the players some room. Whatever is wrong with John Daly OR Greg Norman is inconsequential. What they do in private sould remain there. They are both champions. They both win for our edification and theirs. I agree. To a point. I don’t know about you, but I get really irritated when I hear about professional athletes who get busted for doing drugs or for DWI. Like it or not, they are watched and adored by people of all ages. (that’s an another topic of discussion, so i won’t dive into it)
I belive that moderation is good. The problem is, who decides what is moderate? I want Daly to fully realize cognitively all that he can accomplish and he nor I want a six pack to get in the way. Hell, Daly is the only one who can keep up with Tiger’s drives, and I want to see them play together on many a Sundays as the last twosome.
Given those "God given" talents that Daly has displayed over the past five years, I’m pretty sure that he and Woods will tee it up more than once in the future, sober or trashed. –Jim
Response:
Thank you for your insight. It is a pleasure exchanging ideas with you.
Likewise. You address your opinions clearly and judiciously. No, I wouldn’t disagree with you, but if Nolan Ryan WAS an alchoholic (whatever that is) and he still was a major league pitcher for twenty years I wouldn’t say that he could’ve pitched for thirty if he wasn’t.
But could he have been as dominating as he has been for all those years if he was an alcoholic? IMO, Daly should be dominating the tour right now. I realize his perfomance has suffered this year due to many underlying circumstances, but some of the blame should go to his drinking habits. I belive that moderation is good. The problem is, who decides what is moderate?
I believe that is a personal decision. Regarding Daly, I think he wants to quit altogether. I think he said he needed to learn to focus and concentrate more and doesn’t need alcohol to get in his way. five years, I’m pretty sure that he and Woods will tee it up more than once in the future, sober or trashed.
Hopefully more sober! Can’t wait to see these guys go after each other at PGA Championship in wickedly long Bethpage Black.
Response:
My understanding of the nature and scope of Daly’s return to drinking is that he tried having a couple of beers after a round.
I hope so. He says he did not drink to excess (point of drunkeness) nor every day. It’s quite an exaggeration for those of us who don’t know the facts (and that includes most all of us except John and close friends) to reach the conclusion that he’s constantly drunk and out of control.
I admit I did got most of what I know from Daly’s interview with Golf Digest, but what I said came from Daly’s mouth. A recent report also suggests that after trying alcohol again, he found it no big deal and has stopped again.
Here’s a sure-fire sign of having a problem with alcohol: "again".
Response:
Wayne, how can you say it’s no big deal? I think people are concerned about John Daly the person not the golfer. If someone is an alcoholic or a drug addict you don’t place that person around these temptations. I think Daly is only kidding himself when he says he can stop drinking any time he wants. Speak to recovering addicts and they will tell you this behavior will only lead to self destruction. Also there are plenty of examples of people who thought they could handle an addiction who are in prison, hospitals, or dead. A couple of years ago Daly said he was running stop-lights one night wishing that someone would hit him and kill him. He also said he thought about driving off a cliff as well. All of these actions were brought on by his drinking problem. I’m sorry but these actions ARE a big deal, and if he continues to drink, socially or otherwise he could be headed down this path again. "Everybody know I got more bounce than an ounce" – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My understanding of the nature and scope of Daly’s return to drinking is that he tried having a couple of beers after a round. He says he did not drink to excess (point of drunkeness) nor every day. It’s quite an exaggeration for those of us who don’t know the facts (and that includes most all of us except John and close friends) to reach the conclusion that he’s constantly drunk and out of control. A recent report also suggests that after trying alcohol again, he found it no big deal and has stopped again.
Response:
: Wayne, how can you say it’s no big deal? I think people are concerned : about John Daly the person not the golfer. If someone is an alcoholic or : a drug addict you don’t place that person around these temptations. I : think Daly is only kidding himself when he says he can stop drinking any : time he wants. Please! *smile* This is a GOLF group, I don’t care if Joe Schmoe has sex with dogs if he can play the game and ENTERTAIN a crowd….afterall, Pro Golf is nothing more than ENTERTAINMENT, and Daly entertains his audience. You "think" about alot of unimportant things…. If all of you that are worrying about Daly as a person and whether or not alcohol will hurt him would put half that much energy into fixing your local neighborhoods, the world might be a better place and guys like Daly wouldn’t have to drink to escape reality. *grin* Good Putting! Mark p.s. Just how do you hit a 320 yd. drive down the center of a fairway if you are a self destructive alcoholic? *smile* I know….SWING! — Mark Koenig, Technical Consulting || These views are my own. Hewlett Packard Company, Convex Division || 3000 Waterview Pkwy, Richardson, Tx. 75080 || 78.6% of the people who (972) 497-4298, FAX (972) 497-4141 || quote stats get them wrong.
Response:
"If you don’t work hard and stay on the straight and narrow you will surely screw yourself but good, no matter what you do for a living. You can’t be an alcolholic and an occasional drinker." And then you die. –Jim
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I’be been a Daly fan since he won the PGA Championship: I liked the go-for-broke kind of play style. But the sad thing is, Daly could be so much better. I bet he could have won two or three more majors by now if he had stayed away from alcohol, marriage trouble and junk food. It is indicative of his lack of self-control. He needs to practice more. Nevertheless, I think Daly will get better as he gets older and hopefully wiser. I hate to say it, but when Daly starts to lose some of his prodigous distance, he will become a better all-around player. His short game will become even better and he will start to appreciate his putter more. Daly was quoted as saying he is afraid of not knowing how good he could have been. I hope that doesn’t find out how bad he could be.
You’ve got to be kidding me. There are a hundred drunks on the PGA Tour who have yet to win a tournament. There are a thousand drunks who have yet to make it through Q-School. There are a couple hundred thousand drunks who admire all of these players. You’re telling me that if John Daly quit drinking, kissed the Book and got counciling that he would’ve won two or three MORE majors? Norman drinks Fosters. Maybe you should tell him that big cans WILL make you choke. HIsa private life didn’t make him drop six strokes. I respect your opinion, but we as sport s fans need to give the players some room. Whatever is wrong with John Daly OR Greg Norman is inconsequential. What they do in private sould remain there. They are both champions. They both win for our edification and theirs. If I was drunk and the second alternate at Crooked Stick and won a PGA Championship I’d say that was good. If I was sober and won a British Open I’d say that was good, too. What I wouldn’t say was good is that you’re making one major look better than the other. This is golf. This is life. They’re both a game. –Jim
Response:
As for the "you can’t be an alcoholic and an occasional drinker" thought, it’s worth noting (and I am hardly the final authority on the subject, but) that the British equivalent of AA doesn’t teach total abstention, they teach moderation and control. And my understanding is that they have almost the exact same success rate as AA. -Ron
Response:
My understanding of the nature and scope of Daly’s return to drinking is that he tried having a couple of beers after a round. He says he did not drink to excess (point of drunkeness) nor every day. It’s quite an exaggeration for those of us who don’t know the facts (and that includes most all of us except John and close friends) to reach the conclusion that he’s constantly drunk and out of control. A recent report also suggests that after trying alcohol again, he found it no big deal and has stopped again.
Response:
You’ve got to be kidding me. There are a hundred drunks on the PGA Tour who have yet to win a tournament. There are a thousand drunks who have yet to make it through Q-School. There are a couple hundred thousand drunks who admire all of these players.
And you point is? You’re telling me that if John Daly quit drinking, kissed the Book and got counciling that he would’ve won two or three MORE majors?
If I told you Nolan Ryan is not an alcoholic and that was one of the reasons why he was a major league pitcher for twenty years, would you disagree with me? Let me reiterate what I said about Daly: he is a champion caliber professional. He can win any tourney on any given day on any course. He has been gifted with innate talent that has taken him far. But he could go much further if he can control his drinking. And it’s not drinking to celebrate his winnings, but drinking every night of the week, drinking in the morning before starting his round, drinking packs of beer and staying up all night,…etc. Now, maybe you can drink until you can’t stand up and still play the best golf you can, but not rest of us. Would you disagree that all the time Daly spend drinking and being drunk was spent practicing and broadening his mental strengths, he could possibly have won more tourneys? He sure has the God-given talent to have won more. Norman drinks Fosters. Maybe you should tell him that big cans WILL make you choke. HIsa private life didn’t make him drop six strokes.
I don’t know if Norman is a good example of someone who is dedicated to becoming the best golfer one can be. But I understand what you are saying. I am in no way preaching you to stop drinking all together or that pros should not drink beer, but I am saying each individual should know where to draw the line. Daly knows exactly where HIS line is: sobriety. Like he said himself, "one day at a time". I respect your opinion, but we as sport s fans need to give the players some room. Whatever is wrong with John Daly OR Greg Norman is inconsequential. What they do in private sould remain there. They are both champions. They both win for our edification and theirs.
I agree. To a point. I don’t know about you, but I get really irritated when I hear about professional athletes who get busted for doing drugs or for DWI. Like it or not, they are watched and adored by people of all ages. (that’s an another topic of discussion, so i won’t dive into it) I want Daly to fully realize cognitively all that he can accomplish and he nor I want a six pack to get in the way. Hell, Daly is the only one who can keep up with Tiger’s drives, and I want to see them play together on many a Sundays as the last twosome.
Response:
What is up with John Daly? He walked around all day like he was on some type of drug or something!!! He also needs to slow down a little and CONCENTRATE. It seems to me that he gets over his ball and just hits it. He doesn’t seem to account for wind, contour of the green, or hazards. Maybe he does but he seems like he doesn’t care. if I’m playing and I haven’t won a Skin, you bet I’m working my butt of to win a hole. It was also interesting to hear the announcers talk about Daly. You could hear the sympathy they had for him. Daly needs to take a break, get himself back together, and come out next year with more energy and fire. He could also do himself a favor and lose about 10-20 pounds. The way he looks today is a far cry from his 1991 PGA win, not that he was in great shape to begin. I hope he gets his act together. What a bunch of lame comments.
Here’s a lame comment from Daly’s own mouth: "I will never know how good I could have been (thanks to alcohol, wives, and binge eating)" First of all, He obviously wasn’t feeling well. He wasn’t drunk and I doubt he had a "hangover" He needs to slow down like Bernhard Langer needs to speed up. If that’s his style, that’s his style. He used a driver on every hole and you can work your ass off till it bleeds but if you have an off day playing the likes of Couples, Watson and Woods, obviously three of the hottest golfers out there, just how well do you think YOU would do.
I, being a 20 handicap, would get smothered by them. Daly, being a champion caliber professional, should have at least ACTED like he was working his ass off. I saw apathy and carelessness from Daly. When he won the BO, he played with focus, concentration and effort. Albeit fast, but with care, desire, and determination nonetheless. No, Skins doesn’t compare with BO, but I sure couldn’t tell it from the looks of the three other fellows who were playing with Daly. Physical condition has never been a prerequisite for swinging a golf club properly.
Now here’s a sweeping generalization if I ever saw one. Maybe you should have said obesity has never been a prerequisite for swinging a golf club properly. I don’t see Roseanne out there smacking 250 yard drives. Stadler, Nicklaus and Trevino at times all played well with excess poundage. I’ve seen plenty of winning players waddle around the course.
Ain’t that a pretty thought. Maybe golf should continue to be stereotyped as a "sport" for middle-aged overweight men. Everyone has their ups and downs in life. Your post proves that to me. Why would anyone believe what media has to say about anyone??
Golly, you mean Hogan wasn’t as good as people in media say he was? Take a break get yourself together and come back with some intelligent posts.
Ditto Quit slamming the pros. they’re playing at a level few will ever see, and something as simple as an argument with there wife will throw their game off.
I don’t understand; PGA pros learn how to cope with the pressures of the tour, miles of travel, and handling the toughest courses in the world, but arguements with their wife throws their game out of wack? I sure hope not.
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What is up with John Daly? He walked around all day like he was on some type of drug or something!!! He also needs to slow down a little and CONCENTRATE. It seems to me that he gets over his ball and just hits it. He doesn’t seem to account for wind, contour of the green, or hazards. Maybe he does but he seems like he doesn’t care. if I’m playing and I haven’t won a Skin, you bet I’m working my butt of to win a hole. It was also interesting to hear the announcers talk about Daly. You could hear the sympathy they had for him. Daly needs to take a break, get himself back together, and come out next year with more energy and fire. He could also do himself a favor and lose about 10-20 pounds. The way he looks today is a far cry from his 1991 PGA win, not that he was in great shape to begin. I hope he gets his act together. "Everybody know I got more bounce than an onc
What a bunch of lame comments. First of all, He obviously wasn’t feeling well. He wasn’t drunk and I doubt he had a "hangover" He needs to slow down like Bernhard Langer needs to speed up. If that’s his style, that’s his style. He used a driver on every hole and you can work your ass off till it bleeds but if you have an off day playing the likes of Couples, Watson and Woods, obviously three of the hottest golfers out there, just how well do you think YOU would do. Physical condition has never been a prerequisite for swinging a golf club properly. Stadler, Nicklaus and Trevino at times all played well with excess poundage. I’ve seen plenty of winning players waddle around the course. Everyone has their ups and downs in life. Your post proves that to me. Why would anyone believe what media has to say about anyone?? Take a break get yourself together and come back with some intelligent posts. Quit slamming the pros. they’re playing at a level few will ever see, and something as simple as an argument with there wife will throw their game off. The Skins game was good entertainment. Take it as that. TB
Response:
what does "getting what we deserve" mean? (in terms of john daily)
Response:
I agree that he did fairly well except the putting… wonder if he may have either not been feeling well (a raincoat for the first two holes for the back nine) or had a bad case of nerves…
Response:
Regarding him seeming to shoot too quickly, IMHO that was about how fast he played when he took the 1995 British Open. Especially his putting – I mean it’s always been two quick practice swings, then step up and putt. That’s seems to be his natural speed. In Rotella’s lingo, that would be JD’s "trusting" mentality. Yes, the word seems to be that he is back into the bottle. How much that hurts his game is hard to gauge, but it must be a sign of a hurting person. Here’s hoping he can find the resolve to face his personal devils and at least maintain an equilibrium with them.
Look at the last page of the most recent Golf Digest for a commentary piece about Daly. IMHO talent only goes so far in this world. If you don’t work hard and stay on the straight and narrow you will surely screw yourself but good, no matter what you do for a living. You can’t be an alcolholic and an occasional drinker. The two do not compute. He is an addict and can’t/won’t admit it. Anyone who has ever had a friend or a family member who was an addict knows the story. I don’t feel at all sorry for Daly, only his little girl. He’ll be gone from the tour within two/three years. FREDDIE COUPLES – FORGET THE SILLY SEASON, TIME TO WIN A U.S. OPEN!!!
Response:
John – I’m really sorry to hear that John’s back on the booze. A comment was made on 17 or 18 that the crowd was bleeding for John to win a skin; an observation that most of us, at least I do, feel. Some pro’s seem to be able to feed of the crowd energy. If John could do that he’d drive every green. Swing smoooth, play hard! Greg – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Regarding him seeming to shoot too quickly, IMHO that was about how fast he played when he took the 1995 British Open. Especially his putting – I mean it’s always been two quick practice swings, then step up and putt. That’s seems to be his natural speed. In Rotella’s lingo, that would be JD’s "trusting" mentality. Yes, the word seems to be that he is back into the bottle. How much that hurts his game is hard to gauge, but it must be a sign of a hurting person. Here’s hoping he can find the resolve to face his personal devils and at least maintain an equilibrium with them.
Response:
What is up with John Daly?
Good question. He played over here in Japan a few months back and missed the 2nd-round cut when he shot something like 85. Perhaps he is just living proof of the old adage that we all end up getting exactly what we deserve. ETC
Response:
What is up with John Daly? He walked around all day like he was on some type of drug or something!!! He also needs to slow down a little and CONCENTRATE. It seems to me that he gets over his ball and just hits it. He doesn’t seem to account for wind, contour of the green, or hazards. Maybe he does but he seems like he doesn’t care. if I’m playing and I haven’t won a Skin, you bet I’m working my butt of to win a hole. It was also interesting to hear the announcers talk about Daly. You could hear the sympathy they had for him. Daly needs to take a break, get himself back together, and come out next year with more energy and fire. He could also do himself a favor and lose about 10-20 pounds. The way he looks today is a far cry from his 1991 PGA win, not that he was in great shape to begin. I hope he gets his act together.
I’be been a Daly fan since he won the PGA Championship: I liked the go-for-broke kind of play style. But the sad thing is, Daly could be so much better. I bet he could have won two or three more majors by now if he had stayed away from alcohol, marriage trouble and junk food. It is indicative of his lack of self-control. He needs to practice more. Nevertheless, I think Daly will get better as he gets older and hopefully wiser. I hate to say it, but when Daly starts to lose some of his prodigous distance, he will become a better all-around player. His short game will become even better and he will start to appreciate his putter more. Daly was quoted as saying he is afraid of not knowing how good he could have been. I hope that doesn’t find out how bad he could be.
Response:
(snip about Daly’s pace of play) Yes, the word seems to be that he is back into the bottle. How much that hurts his game is hard to gauge, but it must be a sign of a hurting person. Here’s hoping he can find the resolve to face his personal devils and at least maintain an equilibrium with them.
To whom it may concern… First the man takes a drink, then the drink takes a drink, then the drink takes the man. There is nothing so bad in this world that a good binge can’t make worse. Give it up one day at a time if you have to, just DO IT! Remember: An alcoholic is never cured. Peter McNeil Teaching Professional "I was a social drinker… if someone said I think I’ll have a drink, I said: ’so-shall’ I.
Response:
Exactly.. and if you’ve watched Daly through the years, you know his quick approach to golf is no different today than it was when he won the PGA or the British Open. He’s had problems.. but he says he’s clean – again. Not winning a skin shouldn’t be an open invitation to knock his "booze" problem. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Actually, I thought that all aspects of his game, with the huge exception of his putting, were in fine shape. He missed a lot of makeable putts for birdie, and didn’t convert a single one. To even be in that position, you have to be doing something right. It’s too bad he couldn’t sink any, but the fact that he even hard the opportunity suggests that the rest of his game is in fine shape. -Ron
Response:
Path: news3.cac.psu.edu!howland.erols.net!newsxfer2.itd.umich.edu!news.itd.umich. edu!ren.us.itd.umich.edu!cchad Newsgroups: rec.sport.golf Organization: University of Michigan Lines: 20 NNTP-Posting-Host: ren.us.itd.umich.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII
I think he was too concerned with outdriving Tiger Woods. He was driving the ball nicely, but you could definitely tell he was not concentrating and had no confidence on the greens. His chipping still looked good too. I think if he would have stuck to his own game and not worried about the driving competition so much he could have won. He certainly has enough talent.
Response:
Regarding him seeming to shoot too quickly, IMHO that was about how fast he played when he took the 1995 British Open. Especially his putting – I mean it’s always been two quick practice swings, then step up and putt. That’s seems to be his natural speed. In Rotella’s lingo, that would be JD’s "trusting" mentality. Yes, the word seems to be that he is back into the bottle. How much that hurts his game is hard to gauge, but it must be a sign of a hurting person. Here’s hoping he can find the resolve to face his personal devils and at least maintain an equilibrium with them.
Response:
What is up with John Daly? He walked around all day like he was on some type of drug or something!!! He also needs to slow down a little and CONCENTRATE. It seems to me that he gets over his ball and just hits it. He doesn’t seem to account for wind, contour of the green, or hazards. Maybe he does but he seems like he doesn’t care. if I’m playing and I haven’t won a Skin, you bet I’m working my butt of to win a hole. It was also interesting to hear the announcers talk about Daly. You could hear the sympathy they had for him. Daly needs to take a break, get himself back together, and come out next year with more energy and fire. He could also do himself a favor and lose about 10-20 pounds. The way he looks today is a far cry from his 1991 PGA win, not that he was in great shape to begin. I hope he gets his act together. "Everybody know I got more bounce than an once"
Response:
In other words, Daly needs to give up the booze. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – What is up with John Daly? He walked around all day like he was on some type of drug or something!!! He also needs to slow down a little and CONCENTRATE. It seems to me that he gets over his ball and just hits it.
Response:
Actually, I thought that all aspects of his game, with the huge exception of his putting, were in fine shape. He missed a lot of makeable putts for birdie, and didn’t convert a single one. To even be in that position, you have to be doing something right. It’s too bad he couldn’t sink any, but the fact that he even hard the opportunity suggests that the rest of his game is in fine shape. -Ron