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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – So, has anyone played this course? Is it really that hard? I can’t imagine losing 5 balls, let alone 15 in any string of 18 holes. It’s pretty hard to put a hole / course in perspective watching it on TV so I’m curious if anyone has any first hand knowledge. For the high-handicapper, it’s pretty tough. Lotsa water – lotsa lost balls. I’ve played it a few times. A friend of mine once made a 22 on hole #5, which has a creek running down the right side of the hole. He just kept knocking balls into it like a magnet, and it isn’t even that big of a creek. As we approached the green I asked him if he knew how he stood on that hole. He said, "Well, I hit 9 balls into the water and two others. If he hadn’t made that 10-footer for the 22, he could’ve shot something really high. It’s been a few years since I’ve played it, but my recollection is that it is very tough from the back tees for short hitter like myself (lots of wood shots into greens). It’s not too tough if you play the correct tees for your game, however. But don’t play too far forward or you’ll run out of room in the driving areas. Like many Pete Dye courses, the landing areas narrow after a certain distance so hitting it too far is as bad as hitting it too short. In fact, from the forward tees I once drove the ball into the creek which fronts the green on #4, a par-4. I remember this because I was hitting a Pinnacle # 8 ball, the only # 8 ball I had ever seen at that time. When I went to retrieve the ball out of the shallow creek, lo and behold there were two balls in there. I pulled them both out, and you guessed it ….. both of them were Pinnacle 8’s. Weird course.
So come Annika, tell us what you shot! Bryan
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Hey! I hear it’s a real bear.
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – ""R&B"" <SLAM_SPAM_THANK_YA_MA’AM writes: And obviously, it’s not inconceivable that you could go through a few sleeves of balls on the 17th. Oddly enough, I’ve played several courses that have island green par 3 holes and I’ve yet to lose a ball. My home course has an island green par 3 (actually there are two island greens and two tees, so over the course of a season it plays as four different holes) Since the greens sit in a valley, when the wind is up you can get some swirling wind effects. Maybe not as bad as Augusta’s 12th, but it can be pretty tricky when the wind is coming from certain directions. I certainly can’t claim to have never lost a ball on an island green hole, as I dump a few in the water there each season, but I doubt the 17th at Sawgrass would intimidate me all that much, especially given how short it is. I’m always surprised by how many pros put it in the water, but that little shot might look harder if I had $1 million on the line 
— A good friend will help you move, a true friend will help you move a body. Finkbine GC #13, right? The difference between that hole and 17 at Sawgrass is that 13 at Finkbine is downhill and you can see the green where 17 at Sawgrass is flat. I think the shot where you can see the surface is easier to visualize.
So the 15th at Lake Ridge in Reno, NV should be a piece of cake, right? The tee’s about 120 feet above the island green, on a bluff overlooking the lake. The card lists it as something like 210 yards, but with that elevation it’s tough to figure exactly what club to use. FWIW, it plays like 180. Actually, the island there is pretty darn large, so it’s not terribly intimidating. (FYI, you can check it out at http://www.lakeridgegolf.com) Shag
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Finkbine GC #13, right? The difference between that hole and 17 at Sawgrass is that 13 at Finkbine is downhill and you can see the green where 17 at Sawgrass is flat. I think the shot where you can see the surface is easier to visualize.
Yeah, its surprising how nice psychologically it is to see the green surface, even though it shouldn’t matter at all for the ease of the shot. Plus it also helps keep the wind from drying out the surface of the green, even if all the others are rock hard. — A good friend will help you move, a true friend will help you move a body.
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I doubt the 17th at Sawgrass would intimidate me all that much, especially given how short it is. I’m always surprised by how many pros put it in the water, but that little shot might look harder if I had $1 million on the line Or the greens were as firm as they’ve been known to be there and the wind was blowing 30 MPH as it’s sometimes prone to do on the Florida coast. Randy Douglas tends to think that Stinkbine (his home course), excuse me, Finkbine, is so tough it could host the next US Open . The island greens there have a fair bit of rough around them if you miss the greens. I’d bet that the target area of the shorter green at #13 of Stinkbine (rough and green) is quite alot larger than 17 at Sawgrass. I can’t speak for the farther green, as I have never played to it, although it looked smaller than the front left green IIRC. I do have some fond memories of Stinkbine, as it is where my team won the 4A State High School championship my senior year.
It doesn’t sound like your memories are very fond, considering the name you give it You’re right that there is a lot of rough around the short green, which they use about half the time. The long green has a bit less, and a nice concrete cartpath directly behind, but there’s some room to miss right so long as you have the right distance (the land extension towards the next hole) I never said I thought this hole was as challenging as #17 Sawgrass, just that playing it regularly has meant island greens have never intimidated me, so I don’t think I’d be as nervous on #17 tee as others might. I don’t know why you like to jump in anytime I mention Finkbine to insult it, especially since it has undergone a lot of changes since you last played it 10 or more years ago. You’ve mentioned before you don’t agree with its Golf Digest ranking, or its rating & slope, OK, you don’t like the course, fine, if I ever go nuts and try to hold an RSG Iowa I’ll know you aren’t interested! — A good friend will help you move, a true friend will help you move a body.
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So come Annika, tell us what you shot!
My caddie. I think the first time I ever played it I shot about a 91 from the back tees. My friend, Mikey, stood on the 18th tee needing a par for a 93. He shot 102. Bad time to get the hooks. I think the best I’ve ever played it was a 79. I’ve still got the scorecards around here somewhere, so I’ll have to go find them. Normally, I’ll shoot it in the low 80’s from the blue tees (not the TPC tees). If it’s any hotter I don’t play.
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – ""R&B"" <SLAM_SPAM_THANK_YA_MA’AM writes: And obviously, it’s not inconceivable that you could go through a few sleeves of balls on the 17th. Oddly enough, I’ve played several courses that have island green par 3 holes and I’ve yet to lose a ball. My home course has an island green par 3 (actually there are two island greens and two tees, so over the course of a season it plays as four different holes) Since the greens sit in a valley, when the wind is up you can get some swirling wind effects. Maybe not as bad as Augusta’s 12th, but it can be pretty tricky when the wind is coming from certain directions. I certainly can’t claim to have never lost a ball on an island green hole, as I dump a few in the water there each season, but I doubt the 17th at Sawgrass would intimidate me all that much, especially given how short it is. I’m always surprised by how many pros put it in the water, but that little shot might look harder if I had $1 million on the line — A good friend will help you move, a true friend will help you move a body.
Finkbine GC #13, right? The difference between that hole and 17 at Sawgrass is that 13 at Finkbine is downhill and you can see the green where 17 at Sawgrass is flat. I think the shot where you can see the surface is easier to visualize.
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I doubt the 17th at Sawgrass would intimidate me all that much, especially given how short it is. I’m always surprised by how many pros put it in the water, but that little shot might look harder if I had $1 million on the line Or the greens were as firm as they’ve been known to be there and the wind was blowing 30 MPH as it’s sometimes prone to do on the Florida coast. Randy
Douglas tends to think that Stinkbine (his home course), excuse me, Finkbine, is so tough it could host the next US Open . The island greens there have a fair bit of rough around them if you miss the greens. I’d bet that the target area of the shorter green at #13 of Stinkbine (rough and green) is quite alot larger than 17 at Sawgrass. I can’t speak for the farther green, as I have never played to it, although it looked smaller than the front left green IIRC. I do have some fond memories of Stinkbine, as it is where my team won the 4A State High School championship my senior year. Brad Swanson
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Thanks guys. That gives me a little better idea. Bryan — Bryan Berguson RSG Roll Call http://u1.netgate.net/~kirby34/rsg/bergusonb.htm
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I read an article the other day about the upcoming tournament and the course. 4 guys were headed out to play and somebody (maybe them) was joking about it being a 15 ball course. These guys had handicaps in the high teens. They find out 15 balls isn’t nearly enough and by the 12th hole they’ve abandoned the scorecard and just enjoy the course. So, has anyone played this course? Is it really that hard? I can’t imagine losing 5 balls, let alone 15 in any string of 18 holes. It’s pretty hard to put a hole / course in perspective watching it on TV so I’m curious if anyone has any first hand knowledge. Thanks Bryan RSG Roll Call http://www.rec-sport-golf.com/members/?rollcall=bergusonb
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snip Oddly enough, I’ve played several courses that have island green par 3 holes and I’ve yet to lose a ball. But now that I’ve said that, I’ll probably never hit another island green in my life. <g Randy
You’ve definately jinxed yourself now! :-) — Bryan Berguson RSG Roll Call http://u1.netgate.net/~kirby34/rsg/bergusonb.htm
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I played there the last day that it was open to the public prior to preparation for the tournament. The rough was already in U.S. Open form. Hitting a tee shot in the rough was an automatic 1 shot penalty. My buddy lost a ball in the greenside rough. He saw it land(or so he thought!) Besides the rough… the toughest part of the course is the greens. Relatively small, fast and not a straight putt out there. I have a greater appreciation for the putting on tour.
The rough would be the real foreign thing to me. Around here they keep the rough short enough that it’s usually an advantage to be in it because your ball sits up better. I know about small greens though. Ours are tiny! Bryan — Bryan Berguson RSG Roll Call http://u1.netgate.net/~kirby34/rsg/bergusonb.htm
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I know about small greens though. Ours are tiny!
My home course is being renovated and when I drove by #1 yesterday I could see the outline of the new green. I’m guessing it’s going to be three times the volume it was. It appears we’re getting out of the postage stamp business. But no island greens thank goodness–I have enough trouble getting on land-locked ones. Dave Clary/Corpus Christi,TX Home: http://home.stx.rr.com/dclary Never Forget: http://www.politicsandprotest.org RSG Roll Call http://www.rec-sport-golf.com/members/?rollcall=claryd
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Is it really that hard?
FWIW, they had a graphic on the Golf Channel that said it was the third toughest on the tour last year, by average scores against par. The two that were tougher were both majors.
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I doubt the 17th at Sawgrass would intimidate me all that much, especially given how short it is. I’m always surprised by how many pros put it in the water, but that little shot might look harder if I had $1 million on the line
Or the greens were as firm as they’ve been known to be there and the wind was blowing 30 MPH as it’s sometimes prone to do on the Florida coast. Randy
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Is it really that hard? FWIW, they had a graphic on the Golf Channel that said it was the third toughest on the tour last year, by average scores against par. The two that were tougher were both majors. I thought they said that the 18th was the toughest last year.
That’s what it said in my morning paper!! Dave Clary/Corpus Christi,TX Home: http://home.stx.rr.com/dclary Never Forget: http://www.politicsandprotest.org RSG Roll Call http://www.rec-sport-golf.com/members/?rollcall=claryd
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So, has anyone played this course? Is it really that hard?
Not unless you get the Sunday pin positions as seen here: http://members.aol.com/annika1980//tpc.jpg (I hit it on the green to the right of the hole, ala Tiger, btw. Missed the putt.) Also, avoid the pot bunkers like this one my friend Tim found on hole #11: http://members.aol.com/annika1980//hangtime.jpg
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""R&B"" <SLAM_SPAM_THANK_YA_MA’AM writes: And obviously, it’s not inconceivable that you could go through a few sleeves of balls on the 17th. Oddly enough, I’ve played several courses that have island green par 3 holes and I’ve yet to lose a ball.
My home course has an island green par 3 (actually there are two island greens and two tees, so over the course of a season it plays as four different holes) Since the greens sit in a valley, when the wind is up you can get some swirling wind effects. Maybe not as bad as Augusta’s 12th, but it can be pretty tricky when the wind is coming from certain directions. I certainly can’t claim to have never lost a ball on an island green hole, as I dump a few in the water there each season, but I doubt the 17th at Sawgrass would intimidate me all that much, especially given how short it is. I’m always surprised by how many pros put it in the water, but that little shot might look harder if I had $1 million on the line — A good friend will help you move, a true friend will help you move a body.
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says… And obviously, it’s not inconceivable that you could go through a few sleeves of balls on the 17th. Oddly enough, I’ve played several courses that have island green par 3 holes and I’ve yet to lose a ball.
I’ve played several courses with island green par 3 holes and I’ve _not_ to lose a ball!!!! Kenny — Kenny Stultz Troll and Spam Intollerant RSG Rollcall: http://www.rec-sport-golf.com/members/?rollcall=stultzk
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[snip] And obviously, it’s not inconceivable that you could go through a few sleeves of balls on the 17th. Oddly enough, I’ve played several courses that have island green par 3 holes and I’ve yet to lose a ball.
A buddy of my dad took a 15 on that hole. Some idiot asked him in disbelief how he could take a 15, and he said, "I knocked it on and 14-putted." Shag
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So, has anyone played this course? Is it really that hard? I can’t imagine losing 5 balls, let alone 15 in any string of 18 holes. It’s pretty hard to put a hole / course in perspective watching it on TV so I’m curious if anyone has any first hand knowledge.
For the high-handicapper, it’s pretty tough. Lotsa water – lotsa lost balls. I’ve played it a few times. A friend of mine once made a 22 on hole #5, which has a creek running down the right side of the hole. He just kept knocking balls into it like a magnet, and it isn’t even that big of a creek. As we approached the green I asked him if he knew how he stood on that hole. He said, "Well, I hit 9 balls into the water and two others. If he hadn’t made that 10-footer for the 22, he could’ve shot something really high. It’s been a few years since I’ve played it, but my recollection is that it is very tough from the back tees for short hitter like myself (lots of wood shots into greens). It’s not too tough if you play the correct tees for your game, however. But don’t play too far forward or you’ll run out of room in the driving areas. Like many Pete Dye courses, the landing areas narrow after a certain distance so hitting it too far is as bad as hitting it too short. In fact, from the forward tees I once drove the ball into the creek which fronts the green on #4, a par-4. I remember this because I was hitting a Pinnacle # 8 ball, the only # 8 ball I had ever seen at that time. When I went to retrieve the ball out of the shallow creek, lo and behold there were two balls in there. I pulled them both out, and you guessed it ….. both of them were Pinnacle 8’s. Weird course.
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So, has anyone played this course? Is it really that hard?
The first time I played it I was eager to tackle the famous par-3 #17 ….. the Island Green. We warmed up on the range and I practiced hitting nice little 8-irons about 135 yards, which was the distance of that hole that day. Well by the time we reached #17, my scorecard was in such a shambles that I didn’t really care what I made on that hole. The hole was cut just over the ridge on the left and I hit it right at the stick. The ball landed about 6 feet short of the hole, dead on line, and backed all the way down to the front of the green. I managed a par, one of my few that day. I think that hole was the easiest one we played that day (from the back tees). The green is much larger than it looks on TV.
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I read an article the other day about the upcoming tournament and the course. 4 guys were headed out to play and somebody (maybe them) was joking about it being a 15 ball course. These guys had handicaps in the high teens. They find out 15 balls isn’t nearly enough and by the 12th hole they’ve abandoned the scorecard and just enjoy the course. So, has anyone played this course? Is it really that hard? I can’t imagine losing 5 balls, let alone 15 in any string of 18 holes. It’s pretty hard to put a hole / course in perspective watching it on TV so I’m curious if anyone has any first hand knowledge. Thanks Bryan RSG Roll Call http://www.rec-sport-golf.com/members/?rollcall=bergusonb
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I haven’t played it (yet), but I have walked it. There is a lot of water, so if your golf balls have an H2O-seeking sensor, you’ll need a lot of golf balls. Other than that, there are plenty of places to land the ball where you can find it. It does help having 20,000 people help you look for it in the 4-inch rough. And obviously, it’s not inconceivable that you could go through a few sleeves of balls on the 17th. Oddly enough, I’ve played several courses that have island green par 3 holes and I’ve yet to lose a ball. But now that I’ve said that, I’ll probably never hit another island green in my life. <g Randy Troll intolerant. I took the RSG 2002 Pledge. "Smoke ‘em out … dead or alive, I don’t care." - G. Bush I do not patronize those who advertise in RSG. RSG-ATLANTA 2002 – www.YouGoGolf.com/rsga.org Golf on the web – www.YouGoGolf.com
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I read an article the other day about the upcoming tournament and the course. 4 guys were headed out to play and somebody (maybe them) was joking about it being a 15 ball course. These guys had handicaps in the high teens. They find out 15 balls isn’t nearly enough and by the 12th hole they’ve abandoned the scorecard and just enjoy the course. So, has anyone played this course? Is it really that hard? I can’t imagine losing 5 balls, let alone 15 in any string of 18 holes. It’s pretty hard to put a hole / course in perspective watching it on TV so I’m curious if anyone has any first hand knowledge. Thanks Bryan RSG Roll Call http://www.rec-sport-golf.com/members/?rollcall=bergusonb
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I played there the last day that it was open to the public prior to preparation for the tournament. The rough was already in U.S. Open form. Hitting a tee shot in the rough was an automatic 1 shot penalty. My buddy lost a ball in the greenside rough. He saw it land(or so he thought!) Besides the rough… the toughest part of the course is the greens. Relatively small, fast and not a straight putt out there. I have a greater appreciation for the putting on tour. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I read an article the other day about the upcoming tournament and the course. 4 guys were headed out to play and somebody (maybe them) was joking about it being a 15 ball course. These guys had handicaps in the high teens. They find out 15 balls isn’t nearly enough and by the 12th hole they’ve abandoned the scorecard and just enjoy the course. So, has anyone played this course? Is it really that hard? I can’t imagine losing 5 balls, let alone 15 in any string of 18 holes. It’s pretty hard to put a hole / course in perspective watching it on TV so I’m curious if anyone has any first hand knowledge. Thanks Bryan RSG Roll Call http://www.rec-sport-golf.com/members/?rollcall=bergusonb
Response:
I read an article the other day about the upcoming tournament and the course. 4 guys were headed out to play and somebody (maybe them) was joking about it being a 15 ball course. These guys had handicaps in the high teens. They find out 15 balls isn’t nearly enough and by the 12th hole they’ve abandoned the scorecard and just enjoy the course. So, has anyone played this course? Is it really that hard? I can’t imagine losing 5 balls, let alone 15 in any string of 18 holes. It’s pretty hard to put a hole / course in perspective watching it on TV so I’m curious if anyone has any first hand knowledge.
I’ve played it and all I can say is that it depends. I didn’t think it was that tough if you do a few things right, but I have a couple of buddies who would disagree. I hit it pretty straight and I think I play percentages well. If you keep it in play and put yourself in the proper places, it isn’t too intimidating if the weather cooperates. On the other hand, if you spray it, leave your short game at home or get some wind–or combinations of these–it can be a very long day. One of my friends, a six handicap, hit five balls in the water at 17 and only had one ball left in his bag to play the last hole. He shot 115. *trying hard to suppress laughter* I was in the low 80s, playing from the back tees, but I hadn’t played in six months and I had two doubles and two triples. The only ball I lost was on 14 where I heeled it so badly the ball almost hit me in the left ankle and went into the water next to the tee right behind me. Easy 7. I remember thinking at the time that I would like to do that one again with my game in shape. My claim to fame…2 under for last four: #15–missed 9 feet for birdie #16–made 4 foot birdie #17–missed 8 foot birdie #18–made 6 foot birdie (back left "Sunday pin") On the other hand, get the weather going a bit and lose your swing and it could be a wild ride. Bruce Bruce E. Newman * benewman at nbnet.nb.ca * Fredericton, NB, Canada http://rec-sport-golf.com/members/?rollcall=newmanb http://go.to/bruce_newman